Poker Video: Misc/Other by Tommy Angelo (Micro/Small Stakes)

The Eightfold Path to Poker Enlightenment: Episode Three

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The Eightfold Path to Poker Enlightenment: Episode Three by Tommy Angelo

This week Tommy and Wayne cover Mindfulness. Topics include intentional awareness and tilt control.

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Join Tommy Angelo (author of Elements of Poker) and Wayne Lively as they embark on the Eightfold Path to Poker Enlightenment. This remarkable series is an excellent companion to Tommy's book and has been lovingly crafted over the past year. Featuring brand new musical composition from Tommy, this series is designed with the iPod in mind and transcends standard video poker training. Watch. Listen. Breathe. Win.

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tommy angelo wayne lively the eightfold path to poker enlightenment ipod friendly tilt control

Video Details

  • Game: other
  • Stakes: Micro/Small Stakes
  • 55 minutes long
  • Posted over 5 years ago

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psychop4th

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12 posts
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that was a long week of waiting :< good thing its over now!

Posted over 5 years ago

psychop4th

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12 posts
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shades

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848 posts
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Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes !!! cant wait to watch !!

Posted over 5 years ago

shades

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I joined DC to learn about poker and come out of it learning how to better myself in life , no other pokertraining site can do this , great episode , could listen to ye guys talk all day , look at me all mindfull of my typing! Smile

Posted over 5 years ago

Jafeeio

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127 posts
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Thanks, this really helps me through my losing streak.

Oh wait, no such thing!

Posted over 5 years ago

SteelerFan67

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1 posts
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Not all truck drivers are Asshole's Mr Lively

Posted over 5 years ago

Wayne Lively

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539 posts
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Not all truck drivers are Asshole's Mr Lively



Having once driven a truck, as well as limos and shuttle buses here in Vegas, all I can say is, I was one of that group. However, it is a very small group and most truck drivers I know and have met are super-great guys and I would have rather been part of that group.

Best wishes, westbound and down.

Wayne

Posted over 5 years ago

CoRdo

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145 posts
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Hood

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Bigfish

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I layed down to nap withthis on. Now I didnt actually sleep, it played thru 2.5 times before I got up. And yes I actually was hearing it while laying down to nap. Even fond myself doing some of the excercises.

Excellent work guys.

Posted over 5 years ago

Joeyg50

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435 posts
Joined 05/2009

I have listened to the first 2 episodes 3x.This series is plain ol sick. Thank u Tommy and Wayne u guys are really crushin it. I am definatley going to buy Tommy's book in the near future.I have been waiting 4 this episode and can't wait to hear it. Tommy u da man dog thanx!!

Posted over 5 years ago

Profane

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18 posts
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one word: AWESOME
each episode surprises me

Posted over 5 years ago

Gauss

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378 posts
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is it bad if the intro music causes you to smack a baby

Posted over 5 years ago

nair

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28 posts
Joined 10/2008

Superb. I just woke up this morning and decided to listen to this while lying down and was able to practice all of the exercises in that position. I was surprised to find out how terrible I was at actually counting breathes like Tommy advocates. I can totally relate to what Tommy said about not knowing how mindless you really are until you try these exercises.

I think DC is brilliant for hosting all of Tommy's content. This stuff is just so unique, so inspiring, and so ENLIGHTENING. DC is definitely the only source I have come to know for "poker enlightenment."

Posted over 5 years ago

Realknoooby

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1 posts
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waiting 2 weaks for every new one tilts the hell out of me

Posted over 5 years ago

fishtastic

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203 posts
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Clicking "Reply to Topic", I am aware that I am about to post.
Typing a reply, I am aware that my keyboard goes clickety-clack as I type.
Clicking "Post Reply", I am aware of my amused half-smile.

My favorite of the series so far.

Posted over 5 years ago

EvilSky

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78 posts
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The wayne abides lol , this episode and even the whole series has a TBL air to it in some way. This episode has been my favorite so far and right after as I went down to buy some ciggarettes from the store I walked down the stairs slowly and the whole way there, stood in line breathing and being mindful and when I spoke I was surprised how calm I was, which is usually not the case when Im out of smokes Smile , god I love DC.

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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Clicking "Reply to Topic", I am aware that I am about to post.
Typing a reply, I am aware that my keyboard goes clickety-clack as I type.
Clicking "Post Reply", I am aware of my amused half-smile.



:-/

Posted over 5 years ago

TecmoSuperBowl

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Tribe Leader
5688 posts
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I love watching AND listening to this series, but kudos to the dev team for supplying the MP3 dload for those that need it. They don't get thanked enough, so thank you!

Posted over 5 years ago

Shaner

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53 posts
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really enjoyed this
dig the series, mindfulness is pretty important and this video nails it

Interesting concept that we are in one of 4 postures at all times, hopefully mindful: sitting, standing, walking, and laying down.

"Pain is inevitable, suffering is not"
- Venerable Henepola Gunaratana(Mindfulness In Plain English)

you nailed this
just observe, you do not have to suffer

I am starting to get hungry maybe I should do some mindful eating
or observe this feeling of hungry and see how long it plans to stay

Posted over 5 years ago

chratter

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15 posts
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Great stuff, I really liked this episode and am enjoying this series more and more.

Posted over 5 years ago

AndreasA

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14 posts
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Watched this yesterday and was pretty blown away. Today I tried applying the stuff when A. Playing poker B. Socializing with a group of friends C. Cooking/Eating D. Just chillin'.

Long story short; THANK YOU GUYS!

Posted over 5 years ago

Freudian

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132 posts
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Interesting episode. I don't necessarily agree with Tommy Angelos views on single tasking. I think we are designed for multitasking and have a pretty impressive toolbox to do so effectively. Our brains and sensory systems are fantastic that way.

But each to their own. I have no doubt this outlook on life will work fine for some. A lot of it is common sense. Finding ways to relax and clear your mind of what causes stress is of course valuable for everyone. It will be interesting to see more direct poker applications of the general philosophy presented in this series. Looking forward to the next episodes.

Posted over 5 years ago

TheChosenOne

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SnappieVouz

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Its so great.
You explained everything very well, and wayne said the perfect stuff at the perfect time

Its a hard practice.
But it works fantastic

about the chewing. Why not just take some gum? you can use 1 gum for a whole session

Posted over 5 years ago

Wayne Lively

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Its so great.
You explained everything very well, and wayne said the perfect stuff at the perfect time

Its a hard practice.
But it works fantastic

about the chewing. Why not just take some gum? you can use 1 gum for a whole session



Thanks!

As a gum chewer I can tell you, be careful about chewing gum. It's very easy to give off tells without even knowing it. Be very mindful when you chew gum.

Glad you guys are enjoying the episode. This one was a pleasure for me to work on. I learned a lot.

Wayne

Posted over 5 years ago

SnappieVouz

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I am not using a webcam while playing Mr. Lively, single tasking

Posted over 5 years ago

Al'thor

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defenetly one of the best series on DC, so many moments to be had so far, and were not even halfway there!!

Posted over 5 years ago

chipsnfish

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36 posts
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This is a fantastic series, Thanks Tommy and DC for putting this together.

Posted over 5 years ago

groove

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Pretty sure I asked this on the last episode's comments but is there any chance you can get some of your piano playing down on MP3 for download, Tommy? Or recommend a similar musician who does.

Loving the series btw and love your book.

Posted over 5 years ago

SnappieVouz

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would be a cool DC thing: A one hour mp3 of tommy's piano with the sounds of this serie.

That would make my session so much more tiltless

Posted over 5 years ago

CrazyAl

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Implemented mindful breathing into my session today and it had a PROFOUND effect. Less cussing, no tilt, no quitting short because I got coolered or sucked out on. I actually sat there for 6 hours and won 17 buy ins at HU.
You're the king Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

mogwai316

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Tommy + Wayne,

Are you guys out in Vegas right now for the World Series? If so, are you gonna be at any of the DC events?

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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Pretty sure I asked this on the last episode's comments but is there any chance you can get some of your piano playing down on MP3 for download, Tommy?



I'm going to have to do that or else I'll get kicked out of my family, and that would be really dumb because I love their food. So yes, when the series is all done I'll very likely put together an mp3 or two of the piano tracks from the series. They will be available for free at DC and at my site.

Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

elcholodeamor

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158 posts
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While I watch this, it occurs to me that I am mindless near to 100% of the time. This series has given me some tools to defeat that, but I have pretty severe ADD and I do not like to take the medication I am prescribed for it. I'd rather learn skills that help me succeed. It's like a HUD -- its really a band-aid (albeit it a very usefull one) because it just puts all the information that is ALREADY available in front of you so you dont have to think about it yourself.

What do you think about this, Tommy? For me, because I am not on a professional level, and I am distracted enough by my dog walking in the room or my girlfriend moving around, I feel like I NEED that HUD to make me a winning player.

Tommy/Wayne, when I practice mindful breathing, I lose some awareness of things going on around my sensory field. Are we making a judgement here, saying that the bee outside my window or my dog twitching on my feet while he sleeps is less deserving of my attention? To extrapolate this into the realm of poker, I only play two tables because any more hinders my ability to learn, but I am also aware that I need to play more than 2 tables to practice playing more than 2 tables. How can I learn to be more mindfull of myself, less mindfull of distractions (if we can make a value statement like that and call them distractions) but also more mindfull of my opponents while I increase the number of variables that I must be mindfull of (+5 more players when I add a table).

Thanks, and thank you for the series!

Posted over 5 years ago

SnappieVouz

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2620 posts
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elcho, I have adhd. very good question and never even thought about asking this to Tommy

Thanks!

With my ahdh I notice that i not even get distracted that much, but I have a very hard time quiting because I love playing poker and as you may know as a ADD person it's really hard to stop something because when I am interested in something I am consumed for it for a long time, even when I am losing and i should quit

Posted over 5 years ago

bellatrix

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826 posts
Joined 12/2007

Love the comment about weight loss and mental weight loss. Really hit home as I have been struggling since giving birth to my daughter to keep off weight!

Posted over 5 years ago

Wayne Lively

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539 posts
Joined 05/2007

Tommy + Wayne,

Are you guys out in Vegas right now for the World Series? If so, are you gonna be at any of the DC events?



I live in Vegas. Dunno about the Drunkament, but I'll come out for the Home Game and definitely be there for the Bowlament.

Posted over 5 years ago

ceegee

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622 posts
Joined 05/2008

I am aware that slow moving videos tilt me Poke Tongue

Posted over 5 years ago

Kwantum

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691 posts
Joined 01/2008

This is basically the best poker training video series ever made as far as I'm concerned. I play a lot of HU, and the breathing exercises have been helping me a lot, I play longer, tilt less, and focus more.

Thanks guys!

Posted over 5 years ago

DjCoax

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10 posts
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Ok.

What really hit close to home for me is the topic of the single tasking. In Susan Jeffers' book "Feel the Fear and do it anyway" she talks about focusing on a goal or task and committing yourself 100 percent to that task. By focusing on the one goal you have chosen , you will make your life quality 100 percent better. I can see what she means.

The problem is that when you work and have a busy schedule and a social life and family there is only so much you can do in a day. This really is the big challenge in my life. I cannot single task. Only when it's something that takes me into the zone or the flow

Btw : read this book if you're interested in the concept of the "zone" or "the flow"
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Finding-Flow-Psychology-Engagement-MasterMinds/dp/0465024114/ref=pd_bxgy_b_text_c

In this book it basically is put forward that we are in the zone if the challenge and the skill required is exactly right. If there is not enough challenge , we get bored. If there's not enough skill , we hit a brick wall and fail.

I spend most of my life outside this zone and it frustrates me. When playing poker , too many tables might cause you to hit a wall. Not enough tables and you get bored.

The fact that I am out of this zone makes me reach for other tasks and stuff to do. If only I could do one task at a time and give 100 percent on each task , i think poker and life in general would be so much better.

Tommy,

Choosing is losing they say. But if you have learned to single-task, don't you feel you are missing out on other stuff ? Don't you have to rigorously select what it is you are going to do ?

Perhaps it's just the fact that I realise how limited our time on this earth is , that I feel the need to accomplish something and leave a legacy. Have you experienced something similar and how do you deal with it.

I'm asking this because it's all tied in with this single-tasking that you do.

What is the optimal way to learn to do that ?

Posted over 5 years ago

Guitierez

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260 posts
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Tommy/Wayne, when I practice mindful breathing, I lose some awareness of things going on around my sensory field.



+1

In the fishing example, how does focusing on your partner's words go together with mindful breathing when I'm trying not to do two things at the same time?

Tommy, please elaborate on this, trying to match my own reality to what I'm getting told is a big issue for me.

Thank you for these outstanding insights! Your laughing is very convincing, last but not least the music is beautiful.

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

Tommy + Wayne,

Are you guys out in Vegas right now for the World Series? If so, are you gonna be at any of the DC events?



I'm not in Vegas and I won't be at any of the DC events. Next year I'm thinking about doing the "rent a room for a month" plan and hitting as many DC events as possible.

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

While I watch this, it occurs to me that I am mindless near to 100% of the time. This series has given me some tools to defeat that, but I have pretty severe ADD and I do not like to take the medication I am prescribed for it. I'd rather learn skills that help me succeed. It's like a HUD -- its really a band-aid (albeit it a very usefull one) because it just puts all the information that is ALREADY available in front of you so you dont have to think about it yourself.

What do you think about this, Tommy? For me, because I am not on a professional level, and I am distracted enough by my dog walking in the room or my girlfriend moving around, I feel like I NEED that HUD to make me a winning player.

Tommy/Wayne, when I practice mindful breathing, I lose some awareness of things going on around my sensory field. Are we making a judgement here, saying that the bee outside my window or my dog twitching on my feet while he sleeps is less deserving of my attention? To extrapolate this into the realm of poker, I only play two tables because any more hinders my ability to learn, but I am also aware that I need to play more than 2 tables to practice playing more than 2 tables. How can I learn to be more mindfull of myself, less mindfull of distractions (if we can make a value statement like that and call them distractions) but also more mindfull of my opponents while I increase the number of variables that I must be mindfull of (+5 more players when I add a table).

Thanks, and thank you for the series!



Elcholodeamor,

I've read your post a couple times now and I can't quite seem to sort out what question it is that you asking.

While I watch this, it occurs to me that I am mindless near to 100% of the time. This series has given me some tools to defeat that,



True and true.

How can I learn to be more mindfull of myself, less mindfull of distractions (if we can make a value statement like that and call them distractions) but also more mindfull of my opponents while I increase the number of variables that I must be mindfull of (+5 more players when I add a table).



If you consider your severe ADD to be a mental problem, then what you should do is do the same thing as if you had something you considered to be a severe physical problem. With a physical problem, we do things do make our body better and stronger. With a mental problem, you should do thing to make your mind better, as in, stronger, more resilient, better able to heal it's own problems. Since all mental problems are in some way related to thinking (since thinking is the only mental activity there is), then the place to turn to mend your severe problem is to take many long, slow looks at your thinking, and the way to do that is to sit still for long stretches every morning and just be with yourself and your body and your mind, and practice the skill of concentration by concentrating on your breathing. Call it meditation. Call it medication. Don't matter. Those are just words. It's the act of deliberate, repetitive taming of the mind that matters, and works to increase your ability to be mindful. As to adding tables and listening to birds and all that, as you increase your mindfulness, you'll see that there is plenty of you to go around and do everything you want and need to do with your awareness. I think that if you do start a morning practice, you should save the above post you wrote and read it a couple years from now and see what answers you come up with to your own questions.

Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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I have a very hard time quiting because I love playing poker and as you may know as a ADD person it's really hard to stop something because when I am interested in something I am consumed for it for a long time, even when I am losing and i should quit



Last week, Wayne called me obsessive compulsive. I said right, it's my best feature.

Susuki said, "Each of you is perfect just as you are, and you could use a little improvement."

Hmmm, I lost track of where I was going with all that. Something distracted me. :-)

As to quitting, never fear! The Quitting episode is almost here! :-)

Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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What really hit close to home for me is the topic of the single tasking. In Susan Jeffers' book "Feel the Fear and do it anyway" she talks about focusing on a goal or task and committing yourself 100 percent to that task. By focusing on the one goal you have chosen , you will make your life quality 100 percent better. I can see what she means.

The problem is that when you work and have a busy schedule and a social life and family there is only so much you can do in a day. This really is the big challenge in my life. I cannot single task.



Yet.

Only when it's something that takes me into the zone or the flow

Btw : read this book if you're interested in the concept of the "zone" or "the flow"
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Finding-Flow-Psychology-Engagement-MasterMinds/dp/0465024114/ref=pd_bxgy_b_text_c

In this book it basically is put forward that we are in the zone if the challenge and the skill required is exactly right. If there is not enough challenge , we get bored. If there's not enough skill , we hit a brick wall and fail.

I spend most of my life outside this zone and it frustrates me. When playing poker , too many tables might cause you to hit a wall. Not enough tables and you get bored.

The fact that I am out of this zone makes me reach for other tasks and stuff to do.



I totally get what you are talking about here. I was exactly the same way, severely.

If only I could do one task at a time and give 100 percent on each task , i think poker and life in general would be so much better.



I strongly agree.

Tommy,

Choosing is losing they say. But if you have learned to single-task, don't you feel you are missing out on other stuff ?



No. Not even a teenie little bit.

Don't you have to rigorously select what it is you are going to do ?



I am able to mindfully select what I do, instead of being dragged along by my mind. There is nothing even remotely resembling "rigor" in any of my selection processes. Just the opposite. It's way more relaxing to actually decide things and know I am deciding as I decide, rather than just plow through day after day stressing over what did and didn't happen and what might or might not happen. I notice the lack of stress in previously stressful moments many times per day.

Perhaps it's just the fact that I realise how limited our time on this earth is , that I feel the need to accomplish something and leave a legacy. Have you experienced something similar and how do you deal with it.



Yes I have experienced what you describe. I had no way to deal with it at all. That's why I didn't deal with it. I just lived in it. Only when I started stilling myself every morning did things change, and the change was dramatic. Yes I am sometimes "busy." Yes I sometimes "hurry." But it's stressless. It's mindful. If I am late for an appointment and walking quickly to my car, I am aware of the walking. This makes all the difference in the world.

I'm asking this because it's all tied in with this single-tasking that you do.

What is the optimal way to learn to do that ?



Start here:

www.tommyangelo.com/meditation101.html

Posted over 5 years ago

RiverRock55

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362 posts
Joined 02/2008

Great series Tommy, I started self studying this stuff about a year ago after I got back from a trip to SE Asia. Like all good teachers and writers the content of this series is extremely simple which in turn makes it very powerful. I realize that expressing such abstract ideas and concepts in a clean and simple way is a very difficult task and I commend you for this!

One area of the eightfold path I am very interested in as a poker player is "right livelihood". I'd love to hear your thoughts on this topic. Whenever I come across it in books (just finsihed reading The Heart of the Buddha's Teaching) I never really know if earning the majority of my livelihood playing poker is living right livelihood.

Posted over 5 years ago

Wesen

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24 posts
Joined 08/2008


Choosing is losing they say. But if you have learned to single-task, don't you feel you are missing out on other stuff ?


And I always feel I'm missing out on stuff because I multi-task Smile

Posted over 5 years ago

Echelon

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25 posts
Joined 01/2008

perfect vid and series, respect Tommy!

Posted over 5 years ago

shark_fishin

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266 posts
Joined 03/2008

Thnx very much for doing this, iv been wondering how to do this for a long time.

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

+1

In the fishing example, how does focusing on your partner's words go together with mindful breathing when I'm trying not to do two things at the same time?



You're always doing at least two things at the same time: breathing, and whatever else. The idea here isn't about what (or how many) things you are doing, but rather, what you are paying attention to. Our normal state is to have one of the things we are doing, namely, thinking, dominate. And our thinking tends to not be about precisely what is happening at this instant. If you consciously put some -- even a small amount -- of your attention on your breathing, you will by default derail some of your thinking some of the time, and the result will be that at those moments, you will be paying more attention to other present-tense things besides your breathing, such as, the person talking to you.

Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
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One area of the eightfold path I am very interested in as a poker player is "right livelihood". I'd love to hear your thoughts on this topic. Whenever I come across it in books (just finsihed reading The Heart of the Buddha's Teaching) I never really know if earning the majority of my livelihood playing poker is living right livelihood.



Here's a short definition of right livelihood that I think sums up the detailed teaching pretty well:

Right Livelihood: abstaining from dishonest and harmful means of livelihood

With poker then, the question comes down to the word "harm" in the context of poker. This is an expansive topic. One angle to consider that's a couple layers deep is that if you start thinking that taking someone's money is harmful, then what you're saying is that the "correctness" of playing poker as a livelihood depends on a person's actual poker results. If today he is ahead a little as a "pro," and tomorrow he is behind, then suddenly, because he is now "a losing player," does that mean that so far he hasn't caused harm?

There's much more to it than that. I'm just tossing that out there to show there's lots of room to explore this topic. I think of poker in the context of right livelihood as a means to examine just what the heck "harm" is. I think there's more to "harm" at poker than taking someone's money. In my current perspective on the word "harm," I believe I can play poker without harming anyone, no matter how much I win or lose, so for me, today, playing poker for a living would not be wrong livelihood.

Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

elcholodeamor

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158 posts
Joined 07/2008

"dishonest" -- Of course there is some deception involved in poker. In a recent artictle, Tommy, you wrote about how were (loosely quoted) "incapable of telling the truth" when it comes to discussions about hands.

However, I do not see this as "dishonesty" because it is within the rule set of the game that we do not let people know what cards we have, and we try to trick them. It would be wrong livelihood, however, to be a card mechanic and deal yourself full houses, of course. So where is the line drawn?

Pokertracker/HEM could give us a more interesting discussion into what is or is not dishonest, or to stretch the term a little bit, fair. Is it fair to casual player that we have data mined hand histories and HUDs? I argue it is because it is available to him, and if he read the terms of agreement for joining the site he would see it is in the rules.

Again, I think the crux on whether or not Poker is an example of right livelihood falls on the crux of how we define "harmful". 95% of the time, poker is not a harmful activity to our opponents. People bring money to the casino and if the leave without the money they came with, oh well. Sure they're blue as they're leaving the parking structure, but they will fall asleep just fine. The problem comes when we are playing against gambling addicts or degenerates.

We've all seen them. My friend only plays live poker on the day that unemployment and other government aid checks arrive in peoples mailboxes because of this. He knows this is an easy money day.

Certainly, there are people who are not eating enough because of their gambling problems. Undoubtedly, these people are suffering. But is it US, the people sitting across the table, that are causing them pain? I would argue no. Maybe its just the addictive nature of the game, but we are not there to prey on helpless people. They just ... show up. If I could snap my fingers, I would make poker games less juicy and bar all people that can't help themselves from playing.

But, what about my friend who shows up on the days people get the aid checks?

Thanks again for the enlightening series.

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

"dishonest" -- Of course there is some deception involved in poker. In a recent artictle, Tommy, you wrote about how were (loosely quoted) "incapable of telling the truth" when it comes to discussions about hands.

However, I do not see this as "dishonesty" because it is within the rule set of the game that we do not let people know what cards we have, and we try to trick them. It would be wrong livelihood, however, to be a card mechanic and deal yourself full houses, of course. So where is the line drawn?



Wherever you draw it.



Again, I think the crux on whether or not Poker is an example of right livelihood falls on the crux of how we define "harmful". 95% of the time, poker is not a harmful activity to our opponents. People bring money to the casino and if the leave without the money they came with, oh well. Sure they're blue as they're leaving the parking structure, but they will fall asleep just fine. The problem comes when we are playing against gambling addicts or degenerates.

We've all seen them. My friend only plays live poker on the day that unemployment and other government aid checks arrive in peoples mailboxes because of this. He knows this is an easy money day.

Certainly, there are people who are not eating enough because of their gambling problems. Undoubtedly, these people are suffering. But is it US, the people sitting across the table, that are causing them pain? I would argue no. Maybe its just the addictive nature of the game, but we are not there to prey on helpless people. They just ... show up. If I could snap my fingers, I would make poker games less juicy and bar all people that can't help themselves from playing.

But, what about my friend who shows up on the days people get the aid checks?



I believe that it isn't in your best interest, or mine, or those we judge, for us to try to determine what is right livelihood for anyone but ourselves. If there is ever a clear cut case of minding your own railroad, this is it.

Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

DjCoax

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10 posts
Joined 08/2008

First off, I want to repeat how amazing this series is.

It is giving me the tools I need to get rid of barriers that I have blocking me from achieving further levels. I had already identified those barriers but this has given me the tools.

I already purchased a zabuton and meditation bench and am trying to single-task. However , my mind is very very restless and I have all the trouble in the world calming it. On the rare occasion that I do feel like I have it under control , a huge sense of relief and calm washes over me. But it's hard to consistently reach that state. Especially with work that has been so busy and distracting.

But here is my question and I believe it will be handled in a next episode but I'm firing it anyway.

I have problems handling downswings. I have linked very positive feelings to seeing green positive numbers and very negative feelings to seeing red negative numbers.I would go as far to say that they are linked up to my identity. After a huge downswing i really feel like a genuine loser which spills over into other areas of my life.

I am dealing with this in a completely wrong way , and that is by OR 1. Quitting poker (and then getting back a couple of days/weeks/months later OR 2. Erasing all my hand histories and pretending it didn't happen (clean slate).

When I do this I instantly feel better. I know this is wrong because you can't plug your leaks if you throw your db out ... But what can I do about this and will this get handled later on in the series ... ?

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

But here is my question and I believe it will be handled in a next episode but I'm firing it anyway.

I have problems handling downswings. I have linked very positive feelings to seeing green positive numbers and very negative feelings to seeing red negative numbers.I would go as far to say that they are linked up to my identity. After a huge downswing i really feel like a genuine loser which spills over into other areas of my life.

I am dealing with this in a completely wrong way , and that is by OR 1. Quitting poker (and then getting back a couple of days/weeks/months later OR 2. Erasing all my hand histories and pretending it didn't happen (clean slate).

When I do this I instantly feel better. I know this is wrong...



WHOA! STOP RIGHT THERE!

One could say that if you inject heroin into your veins in order to "instantly feel better," that this could be considered by some to be "wrong."

But to throw away data about the past in order to instantly feel better – it seems to me that nothing could be more right. But then, I put a high priority on feeling better. Maybe you should too.

"... because you can't plug your leaks if you throw your db out ..."

Sounds to me like there are times for you when the database itself IS the leak.

Okay, I do hear what you're saying. A couple times in the series, Wayne and I talk about Bandaids and cures. Throwing out your db would be a bandaid. It would help ease the pain that comes from looking at it, but it wouldn't cure the real disease that makes looking at your db painful in the first place.

Bandaids are good! Use them!

I think you should try going a few days without keeping any records or looking at them or saving them. Just fly totally free for a few days, or even a couple weeks, and THEN step back and look at your whole poker situation and ask yourself if you really "need" your db to "plug leaks." Or are you just addicted to and identified with the whole mess.

I already purchased a zabuton and meditation bench



Use them, and you’ll quickly see that:

...numbers ... are linked up to my identity.



Is true.

Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

ThePureNuts

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8 posts
Joined 01/2008

This is this most untilting hour I've ever had. So great watching a poker series that has a ton of value not just for poker but for life also. It says Bi- weekly on the series though, isn't that twice a week? Probably should change that to Bi-monthly or am I wrong?

Either way so good looking forward to ep4

Posted over 5 years ago

DiggerTheDog

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696 posts
Joined 09/2008

Tommy
There are many things I would like to say to you. But I think it would be incoherent and cluttered.
So I will say just two things.

Thank you Sir.

Keep up the good work

Dan

Posted over 5 years ago

Wayne Lively

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539 posts
Joined 05/2007

Tommy
There are many things I would like to say to you. But I think it would be incoherent and cluttered.
So I will say just two things.

Thank you Sir.

Keep up the good work

Dan



Incoherent and cluttered? Tommy's used to that. Trust me. Lots of opportunity to train.

Tommy is on vacation. So, like someone who picks up the Oscar for the winner I'll say, "Tommy thanks you and promises he will keep up the good work."

Wayne

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

This is this most untilting hour I've ever had. So great watching a poker series that has a ton of value not just for poker but for life also. It says Bi- weekly on the series though, isn't that twice a week? Probably should change that to Bi-monthly or am I wrong?

Either way so good looking forward to ep4



I just checked. Bi-weekly means "once every two weeks."

Posted over 5 years ago

drgenefish

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5 posts
Joined 10/2008

Tommy,

When at the poker table (for example..but my question applies to anywhere in life), if you are deeply concentrating on your breathing, won't that take away from the concentration of what is going on at the table? Or do you eventually do both? If so, isn't this sort of multitasking?

Also, words distract me...would I get the same benefit from the exercise if I just focused on my body breathing rather than saying the words in my head that you suggested?

- Gene

Posted over 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

Tommy,

When at the poker table (for example..but my question applies to anywhere in life), if you are deeply concentrating on your breathing, won't that take away from the concentration of what is going on at the table? Or do you eventually do both? If so, isn't this sort of multitasking?



Yes you do both. Yes it's sort of multi-tasking. As to "taking away concentration," what you'll come to realize right away if you do the practice is that everything is always changing. No two breaths are alike. No amount of concentration on anything is stable. It's always in flux. You might be focused 15% on your breathing and 85% on sounds for 1/2 of an exhale, and then, poof, you are suddenly no longer aware of your breathing, or, you might suddenly have 60% of your attention on the last bit of exhale, and then, by doing that, you find yourself suddenly completely focused on the next sentence of the email you are writing, or on the next spoonful of soup you put into your mouth. Think of mindful breathing as an ever-present stream of present-tenseness that you can ride anytime you like. It always, always, always increases the amount of attention you are applying toward what is now. That's because breathing is always now.

"Also, words distract me...would I get the same benefit from the exercise if I just focused on my body breathing rather than saying the words in my head that you suggested?"

Yes.

Tommy

Posted over 5 years ago

teneights

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7 posts
Joined 09/2008

teneights

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7 posts
Joined 09/2008

Just wanted to say this episode is just amazing.. I tried it right away during the video and then in my first session and even did the breathing practice several times today during work.. It feels extremely weird to do it, but I think it actually works (I'm always very sceptical..) because it fills up my mind with my breathing and counting, instead of other often bad thoughts. I don't really feel my breath is such a cool thing to focus on, but I guess that's not the point.. during the practice I feel no or very little other thoughts wandering around.. if I do I lose countPoke Tongue But then I can just restart. So this just might be the thing that keeps my mind calm during sessions so that I can actually play my a-game for more than 5minutes, that would mean I might actually become a winning player after a 200k hands break even grind thusfar.. wow

and I think it's very very valuable for life too, just need to practice alot I guess and im sure itll work out for the better! Grin

amazing.. to find such valuable info on a pokersite Poke Tongue

Posted over 5 years ago

G5TRANCE

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6 posts
Joined 07/2009

Thank you Mr. angelo and Mr. Lively.


From a new memberSpade

Posted about 5 years ago

monsterzero123

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3 posts
Joined 08/2009

Thanks so much Tommy - I will definitely try this next time I go to LC's

Posted about 5 years ago

richsmoove

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15 posts
Joined 08/2009

thx tommy, the breathing exercise helped me in my weekend warrior softball game...i had made a big two out error which led to 5 more runs in the inning and really put me on tilt at the plate. i poppeed up to ss my next at bat. it was really bothering me while i was on the field then i rememebered your breathing techniques. i used em while standing on the diamond. it really relaxed me and i ended up hitting two triples and a double. thx again tommy.

Posted about 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

... breathing techniques. i used em while standing on the diamond. it really relaxed me and i ended up hitting two triples and a double.



This is results oriented thinking.

lol

Posted about 5 years ago

Pickaface

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463 posts
Joined 10/2008

It's clear after this episode that you're a single-tasking. What do you think about listen to music while multitabling? I think it will take some focus off the table but I think it's more fun to play long session with music.

Posted about 5 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

It's clear after this episode that you're a single-tasking. What do you think about listen to music while multitabling? I think it will take some focus off the table but I think it's more fun to play long session with music.



I think we should get a research grant. Wouldn't it be great to actually know the EV of listening to music?

I listen to music now and then when I play. I have noticed that some music uses up much more of my mind than other music. I think I suck at poker for example if I'm listening to, say, Black Dog by Led Zeppelin. I'm like, Huh? My Turn? Fold!

I think if we look at the number of players who do just fine mixing poker and headphones, we have to conclude that this is another "it depends" category.

Tommy

Posted about 5 years ago

RedBarracuda

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20 posts
Joined 10/2008

Time Link to 00:14:10

lol. excellently done with the breating in and out..

Posted almost 5 years ago

urinpain

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292 posts
Joined 08/2009

obv great content and I guess it may be changing my life (I'm really looking forward to it it really does).
I'd love to hear/see/read more on this specific, let's call it "buddha"-stuff. Therefore I'm going to buy some books about this topic (breathing, meditation, life without suffering, buddhas pieces of wisdom, etc.).

And that's where you should hop in Tommy (or any other guy who is into this stuff) Wink
Do you recommend any "good" books (I know there are now "bad" books in our way of thinking Wink) on this topic?

Posted over 4 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007


Do you recommend any "good" books (I know there are now "bad" books in our way of thinking Wink) on this topic?



I put a list of my favorite titles at this page:

http://tommyangelo.com/meditation_101.html

Posted over 4 years ago

CasinoR7

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27 posts
Joined 01/2010

Here is one of my favorite books on the topic. The bhagavad gita, great work on equanimity, work ethic, meditation and devotion. It's available for download for free with extensive commentary of Swami Chinmayananda:

http://www.chinmayauk.org/Resources/Downloads.htm
http://www.chinmayauk.org/Resources/GitaDownload.ZIP

I hope you find these links useful.

I have read several commentaries, but this one is outstanding and very comprehensible for people with modern western backgrounds.

Chapter 2 is a must read for poker players. It deals with psychology of result oriented thinking and variance.

Also, the titles of Dr. Alan Schoonmaker's books "Your best poker friend," and "Your worst poker enemy" are philosophical concepts borrowed from discussion in chapter six of this ancient work:

" The Self is the friend of the self for him who has conquered himself by the Self, but to the unconquered self, the Self stands in the position of an enemy like the (external) foe."

Posted over 4 years ago

dopefienddan

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3 posts
Joined 04/2010

Time Link to 00:49:17

I was never aware how much I breathe during a video. I`m exhausted.

Posted over 4 years ago

Snuwerd

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148 posts
Joined 04/2010

What les fux, I think I found it. Lets see how it turns out in the next few weeks. I watched 3 episodes and I played a session, and I don't think my mind has ever been as clear as this time. Especially the 'anticipate' and 'right thinking' (about analyzing a hand without judgement) really finally made me the way I'd play if I were almost objectively looking at the game.

Thanks a lot!

Oh, and i love the piano Grin

Posted over 4 years ago

Farmer108

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293 posts
Joined 07/2010

Time Link to 00:41:52

What is your opinion on taking notes during play? As you take a note, you are missing action, but by not taking the note, you may forget vital information. Is there a way to notetake, but remain single minded?

Posted almost 4 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

What is your opinion on taking notes during play? As you take a note, you are missing action, but by not taking the note, you may forget vital information. Is there a way to notetake, but remain single minded?



For you, taking notes is simply part of the game. It's not a "distraction from the more important task of playing." Think of note-taking as one of the many profitable things you do as you "play poker."

Can you take notes and remain single-minded? Yes! Of course! There is no task that can't be done single-mindedly. If you take notes mindfully, then single-mindedness is maintained. You single-mindedly takes notes while you are taking notes, then you single-mindedly resume focusing on your game(s) when the note is finished. If you go back and forth between those two tasks a hundred thousand times per year, then your objective is to be aware when you have moved from one task to the other as many times as possible.

I am playing now.

I am taking a note now.

Let those two thoughts come and go thousands of times along with all the other less mindful thoughts.

And while we're here, read this:


http://tommyangelo.com/articles/on_the_importance_of_paying_attention.htm

:-)

Tommy

Posted almost 4 years ago

ceegee

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622 posts
Joined 05/2008

Time Link to 00:43:12

so would you be against listening to music while playing?

EDIT: read it in the replies, but any update on this maybe?

Posted almost 4 years ago

ceegee

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622 posts
Joined 05/2008

maydayncs

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93 posts
Joined 12/2010

I have adhd as well, and hate medication. In my words, it makes me feel like a zombie, and not one of those fast cool ones either. I've found that music with headphones helps me to focus. Not any particular type, just something in the background to help tune out all the little distractions I have

Posted almost 4 years ago

soleztis

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DC Dalai Lama
1026 posts
Joined 09/2010

Time Link to 00:17:40

"she's gonna be alright with it..." well then you're lucky because i would be looking forward to "you should have left earlier!!"

Posted almost 4 years ago

Allermand_DK

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955 posts
Joined 11/2008

Time Link to 00:08:41

Hey guys. GREAT video series, how long would you advocate me to do mindful breathing before a session?

Posted almost 3 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

No less than five minutes, and 20 minutes is plenty.

Posted almost 3 years ago

runners23

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129 posts
Joined 01/2011

Love all of the positive energy in here, just thought Id chime in! Love your work guys, and thx for the links Im buying my meditation bench and pillow Tomorrow! Cant wait to start meditating, the breathing really does work! Cant wait to watch the next one!

Posted almost 3 years ago

micsquab

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750 posts
Joined 09/2010

All I can say is WOW! Just discovered a leak I didn't know I even had. Thank you very much.

Posted over 2 years ago

Katphish

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57 posts
Joined 02/2012

When I started out on Party Poker many years ago I won a sat to a daily $150 game, I was pretty stoked. I am a big Grateful Dead fan and a friend gave me a Dead video to wattch and I put it on when I played the $150 mtt. I was doing great up until the video was over and I got knocked out with in a minute of it stopping. It seemed like the music keeped me focus on the game.

Do you think listening to music while playing online always concentration on poker better or worse?
Does it matter which music?
I listened to Beethoven and the Grateful Dead live while doing term papers in college, I thought it stimulated my mind while listening to them.

Is listening to the Eightfold Path to Poker Enlightenment a distraction while playing a couple of mtts?

Posted over 2 years ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

"I listened to Beethoven and the Grateful Dead live while doing term papers in college, I thought it stimulated my mind while listening to them."

Nice range. :-)

"Do you think listening to music while playing online always concentration on poker better or worse?"

It works for you, and that's all that matters!

T

Posted over 2 years ago

Noreaga

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304 posts
Joined 10/2011

Beautiful.I love the piano music, it`s very relaxing.

Posted over 2 years ago

AycheDubbleYou

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234 posts
Joined 06/2012

the music interludes are eerily similar to the tracks when someone is getting whacked in "goodfellas" Smile

Posted about 2 years ago

kamitis

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3 posts
Joined 09/2012

StilettoMafiosa

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3 posts
Joined 04/2010

mario rasta1

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18 posts
Joined 03/2013

Time Link to 00:40:55

hi, what about playing poker on 6 tables plus listening to music wich wont distract us from concentration, a kind of instrumental music, no lyrics at all? what i think is that this music is good to make it part of what are you doing, i want to know ur opinion, thx for the videos, are espectacular

Posted over 1 year ago

Tommy Angelo

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248 posts
Joined 10/2007

hi, what about playing poker on 6 tables plus listening to music wich wont distract us from concentration, a kind of instrumental music, no lyrics at all? what i think is that this music is good to make it part of what are you doing, i want to know ur opinion, thx for the videos, are espectacular



Hi Mario,

I think listening to music while six tabling is fine. If you think it's a good idea it almost certainly is, especially with no lyrics.

Tommy

Posted over 1 year ago

mygameispoke

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150 posts
Joined 02/2013

Favourite episode so far, great stuff Tommy!

Posted 9 months ago



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