DosXX
353 posts
Joined 01/2008
Just want to reiterate, I'm looking for hands from the community for next week's video. I am looking for hands where we are in the CO or on the button, almost any dynamic will work. Please indicate stats/reads on relevant players. No guarantees I will use your hand, it depends how many I get, but it won't get reviewed unless you send it. Please limit your hands to 2 so I don't have to sort through a ton. PM or hit me up on skype: dosxxpoker.
Posted about 1 year ago
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JaneTheHot
129 posts
Joined 07/2007
Time Link to 00:22:58
I think that this flop is player dependant in terms of CR vs C/C. Vs a good who is loose and SD bound I think CR is better. It is better because he will NOT fold made hands like 66-JJ and is unlikely to get out of line later streets. This board is wet and will cause some players to want to SD on a non diamond turn and riv. I think if the flop was AQ5o, then c/c is far superior play since there are less draws and dudes that are SD bound can fold their 66-JJ.
Posted about 1 year ago
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chewchew
47 posts
Joined 09/2010
DosXX
353 posts
Joined 01/2008
Can you explain your point more thoroughly about capping preflop to make the reg play more honest? With the short fish in the pot wouldn't the pot be protected postflop, anyway?
Or is this a limit thing I'm missing, I'm not much of a limit player.
Well, I would say the pot won't be protected *that much* postflop, because the fish's range is so wide, that the other player can still semibluff raise to try and get it HU with the fish with a weaker range than normal, it's actually somewhat of an incentive for the other player to fold out my range and get it HU on the flop. That's specifically to your protected pot point.
Typically, when players 4bet they are given more respect postflop because ranges are so much more narrow and showdown bound compared to a typical fish isolation play and then calling the other player's 3 bet (our range becomes less strong and less able to showdown). It's one of the reasons we can 4bet, because sometimes investing that extra small bet will let us win the whole pot when someone misreads our range as stronger than it is and doesn't bluff is off the pot.
Posted about 1 year ago
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chewchew
47 posts
Joined 09/2010
Yes, the concept of misrepresenting the range and to get initiative is pretty clear, that's not really my question. I'm wondering how the short fish in the hand changes the whole game (if at all) and how you could be bluffed off the best hand/draw when there are so many bets in the pot already.
Give an example of a case please where you would be bluffed off the best hand/draw. Maybe on a board of AK7 where he has 88 and cb?
I still can't really wrap my head around this, say with 10,5 small bets on the flop wouldn't you be able to draw to most stuff unless the fish donks and you might be afraid of getting trapped or if he cr. Maybe let's just assume the fish will already be allin on the flop (like in this case, basically, duh).
Posted about 1 year ago
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DosXX
353 posts
Joined 01/2008
It's less about being bluffed off the best hand per se, and more about being bluffed off equity when we can't really call. So the AK7 example is pretty good, since we could easily have 6 clean outs in that scenario against both players. Another example would be if he decides to get frisky on some turns lets say we c/call twice on a board of J96Q and he bets a 2 on the river. Normally, I think we'd probably have to fold that hand given the action and the all-in player, but we can get bluffed (by 88, by AK), because the button bets for whatever reason (maybe expert, maybe spew) and gets us to fold the best hand in the pot.
We could also be put in some bad situations when we c/r the flop and the button decides to raise the turn. Lets say we c/r the flop on a 44T board then bet a K turn, if he raises, we probably have to fold, but he could occasionally have something spazzy like AQ/AJ and win the pot with is play. Now, when we 4bet, I think we eliminate the majority of those situations. Remember, it's probably more about having the initiative on the flop/turn and getting our opponent to fold equity, that's really the more common scenario.
Posted about 1 year ago
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BigBadBabar
4088 posts
Joined 03/2007
Something else is that we can check back the turn sometimes when we're in position, saving half a bet when drawing with no fold equity/value (4 sb pf, 1 sb flop, 0 turn = 5) as opposed to not capping pre (3 sb pf, 1 sb flop, 2 sb turn = 6)
I think it's also useful for widening and balancing your range a bit without giving up much.
Posted about 1 year ago
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GGB
59 posts
Joined 10/2007
DosXX
353 posts
Joined 01/2008
You say he has AK,TT+ by default. Against that range, an ace on the river is a very good card after the K high flop. It reduces AA from 6 to 3 and AK from 12 to 9 combination. You win here around 40% if he bets his entire range. (I know, why would he, but he had 5BB)
Yes thanks for adding some math into the river call. It's definitely close because no normal villain bets his entire range, but as you mention, he has 5 BBs so maybe he gets a little spastic. Also, if we add in a few combos of things like QJs or TJs preflop, we extend his barreling range to the river quite a bit so our call becomes much easier.
Posted about 1 year ago
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