Poker Video: No Limit Hold'Em by WiltOnTilt (Mid Stakes)

YAY

OMAGADSE.

OMAGADSE.

I LOLd.

Hell yeah!

Hielko always comes through with some great Whackem's. This guy is going to go robusto for sure.

A French WoT:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61hzLYfRYyc&feature=related

Great vid Wilt. Really liked all the input on dealing with all the excessive 3betting that's going on.

About the excessive 3betting talk I have a question, I don't play these levels, but from the video it looked like the majority of the reg where in their comfort zone in 3bet pots so I am wondering whether there is some merit to cold call more in position to take them out from their known territory and play pots where the stack/pot size ratio leaves more room for more creative plays. This obviously requires greater hand reading than the average player, but I guess this should be something that someone who is trying to beat 2/4 has to handle already pretty well.

2nd great video in the series!

Hielko, you mentioned that you started at 25nl early last year (IIRC), which I think is a pretty good and solid result (and a great inspiration for us struggling players...) - it would be great to get your brief analysis on

- how long at each level
- biggest struggle at each level and how did you solve it
- at each level, what did you do well compared to your peers to move up

thanks!

About the excessive 3betting talk I have a question, I don't play these levels, but from the video it looked like the majority of the reg where in their comfort zone in 3bet pots so I am wondering whether there is some merit to cold call more in position to take them out from their known territory and play pots where the stack/pot size ratio leaves more room for more creative plays. This obviously requires greater hand reading than the average player, but I guess this should be something that someone who is trying to beat 2/4 has to handle already pretty well.

I think this is certainly good with a lot of hands, and this is also what i do with a lot of hands. I don't know what hands exactly you see me 3betting in position in this video, but usually a lot of my in position 3betting range consists of hands that aren't good enough to cold call in position (so i can do exactly that with the hands that are good enough).

2nd great video in the series!

Hielko, you mentioned that you started at 25nl early last year (IIRC), which I think is a pretty good and solid result (and a great inspiration for us struggling players...) - it would be great to get your brief analysis on

- how long at each level
- biggest struggle at each level and how did you solve it
- at each level, what did you do well compared to your peers to move up

thanks!

I'll try to answer your question .

25NL: I've have played just 18K hands of 25NL before moving up, and my winrate in that sample was just 3bb/100. The reason that I moved up is that I thought that I could easily beat those games, and I used to play up to 10/20 limit so my bankroll wasn't really an issue.

50NL: I played a little more than 100K hands of 50NL, and right from the start I was crushing this level using a nitty 19/16 style. My winrate was around 13bb/100 while 8 tabling. It's hard to say what specific things I did better than my opponents, but I do think that most players at this level are afraid to get thin value. You see a lot of people taking pot control lines while I would never worry about that and just bet/bet/bet.

100NL: The first level that gave me some troubles. I was still playing 8 tables at the same time when I tried to move up to 100NL and altough I did beat the game, I was a very marginal winner at first. I think this a lot of this was caused by fps and trying to outplay people everytime I got 3bet from the blinds. Calling every 3bet in position and then floating or bluff minraising flops isn't smart. It's going to work a decent amount of the time, but not often enough if you don't pick your spots well. When I reduced the number of tables from 8 to 4, starting to think harder about my decisions I finally managed to beat this limit at a solid rate. Lifetime my winrate is probably just 5bb/100 over 160K hands.

200NL: After I started beating 100NL at a solid rate I moved up to 200NL pretty quick (I was already easily rolled) and I guess I just started to beat this level from day one. I continued to play 4 tables mostly (sometimes 6) and I also started to really table select instead of just joining some random tables. Played 160K hands lifetime at this level with a winrate of 10bb/100.

400NL: We will have to see how this goes... certainly the biggest jump skillwise so far. You see a lot of regs the tables that are playing 600NL/1KNL, and you obviously also see the better 200NL regs.

I was really interested in your descussion about having an OOP calling range to 3bets. I have often felt like i should fold my TT or JJ when faced with a 3bet from a player in possition since i don't have a real calling range, so my hand would be face up.
I tryed a cold call with KJo and check-raised flop today, rather than a 4bet, and it netted me a lot of money vs someone who was obviously very light.

Don't suppose you could outline a range that would be ok to call OOP vs someone with say 7-10% 3bet assuming we would check-raise a lot, or does it just depend on how your opponent plays in 3bet pots?

This is a great series. My one suggestion would be for Hielko to argue less with his coaches and ask more questions if he is unsure about what they are saying. It is a bit frustrating to have him talking over them so much. Looking forward to the next videos!

Great series.

How many hands did you play per month at the beginning? (NL 25 to NL 100 inclusive)

Also, I was wondering if you could give me a link to the autorebuy mod you are using for PS.

This is a great series. My one suggestion would be for Hielko to argue less with his coaches and ask more questions if he is unsure about what they are saying. It is a bit frustrating to have him talking over them so much. Looking forward to the next videos!

^^ that got kind of annoying to me as well. If there is a concept I don't quite agree with at first I will definitely present my case as to why I feel it is right but it seemed like every suggestion WoT made Hielko would disagree with. The conversation about 1 hour in about squeezing with KK was painful to listen to. WoT made several good points, in my opinion, as to why he should make the raise size smaller but Hielko seemed stubborn about his own point of view.

Great series. I LMAO about Hielkos dutch dialekt, "i know the fish allways bluffs smalish" snapfistpump boojah call, hhahaha !

Great series.

How many hands did you play per month at the beginning? (NL 25 to NL 100 inclusive)

Also, I was wondering if you could give me a link to the autorebuy mod you are using for PS.

I guess on average I played like 40K hands a month, but some months i played almost nothing while on other months i played 60-80K hands.

I'm not using a mod for the autorebuy by the way, it's a standard feature of Pokerstars

^^ that got kind of annoying to me as well. If there is a concept I don't quite agree with at first I will definitely present my case as to why I feel it is right but it seemed like every suggestion WoT made Hielko would disagree with. The conversation about 1 hour in about squeezing with KK was painful to listen to. WoT made several good points, in my opinion, as to why he should make the raise size smaller but Hielko seemed stubborn about his own point of view.

Sorry about that, I guess... but I obviously have my reasons for doing what I do, and when my coach wants to do something else I want to know why my reasons behind it aren't good (enough).

its also the dutch mentality, we're used to having discussions etc. its part of our education system; we're taught to take nothing for granted (in order for our search of the 'truth'). however i see how this can be a bit annoying to them foreigners

its also the dutch mentality, we're used to having discussions etc. its part of our education system; we're taught to take nothing for granted (in order for our search of the 'truth'). however i see how this can be a bit annoying to them foreigners

I for one like the discussion. Not so much the talking over each other but the discussion is good imo.

I'll try to answer your question .

25NL: I've have played just 18K hands of 25NL before moving up, and my winrate in that sample was just 3bb/100. The reason that I moved up is that I thought that I could easily beat those games, and I used to play up to 10/20 limit so my bankroll wasn't really an issue.

50NL: I played a little more than 100K hands of 50NL, and right from the start I was crushing this level using a nitty 19/16 style. My winrate was around 13bb/100 while 8 tabling. It's hard to say what specific things I did better than my opponents, but I do think that most players at this level are afraid to get thin value. You see a lot of people taking pot control lines while I would never worry about that and just bet/bet/bet.

100NL: The first level that gave me some troubles. I was still playing 8 tables at the same time when I tried to move up to 100NL and altough I did beat the game, I was a very marginal winner at first. I think this a lot of this was caused by fps and trying to outplay people everytime I got 3bet from the blinds. Calling every 3bet in position and then floating or bluff minraising flops isn't smart. It's going to work a decent amount of the time, but not often enough if you don't pick your spots well. When I reduced the number of tables from 8 to 4, starting to think harder about my decisions I finally managed to beat this limit at a solid rate. Lifetime my winrate is probably just 5bb/100 over 160K hands.

200NL: After I started beating 100NL at a solid rate I moved up to 200NL pretty quick (I was already easily rolled) and I guess I just started to beat this level from day one. I continued to play 4 tables mostly (sometimes 6) and I also started to really table select instead of just joining some random tables. Played 160K hands lifetime at this level with a winrate of 10bb/100.

400NL: We will have to see how this goes... certainly the biggest jump skillwise so far. You see a lot of regs the tables that are playing 600NL/1KNL, and you obviously also see the better 200NL regs.

Great summary, thank you very much!

So you obviously feel that 100K hands is an appropriate sample before considering moving up?

Surely you will be way over rolled though for the next level?

Great summary, thank you very much!

So you obviously feel that 100K hands is an appropriate sample before considering moving up?

Surely you will be way over rolled though for the next level?

I think cashing out some money once a month or so is important. It's part of the poker fun, and nothing is more demoralizing than building up a roll for level x, losing half of it, and having to start all over again at the lower level. If you cashed out some you have at least something to be happy with; you don't have the feeling you played all those hours for nothing.

I thought the discussion flowed well. I think it's much better to say "I usually...." or "what about...." than just to say "yeah OK". It's doesn't mean you disagree with what is said but just prompts more in depth discussion - this is true regardless of the skill difference of the two people talking and also is not limited to poker discussion.

I think cashing out some money once a month or so is important. It's part of the poker fun, and nothing is more demoralizing than building up a roll for level x, losing half of it, and having to start all over again at the lower level. If you cashed out some you have at least something to be happy with; you don't have the feeling you played all those hours for nothing.

This is something I can see the sense in, although I am in two minds about.

I want to be rolled for NL200 by the late end of 09 oct/novemeber time. Thing is, I think that I can do this quicker IF I DONT cashout.

I'm playing NL40 atm with $1000BR, soon going to NL50, but I think cashing out would slow me moving up. I tried withdrawing abit of my winnings before, when I was playing NL20 and NL30 for most of last year - where I would withdraw $300-400 a month but as result end up stuck at the same stakes all year (ie, not allowingmyself to be rolled enough to play NL50-NL100 comfortably) - so basically, my long winded way of saying, how much % (if at all) should I take out while still being able to move up realistically quickly?

I think what the best option is depends mostly on what you want to archieve. If your goal is to move up to 200NL as fast as possible you shouldn't cash out. But the question is if you are really ready for 200NL after you have 40bi for this level, because I would want to be a decent winner at 100NL first before moving up. And once you are a decent winner at a certain level, making enought money for a roll for the next level really isn't that hard.

This is a great series. My one suggestion would be for Hielko to argue less with his coaches and ask more questions if he is unsure about what they are saying. It is a bit frustrating to have him talking over them so much. Looking forward to the next videos!

I read the comments before I watched the vid and was prepared for Hielko to become frustratingly stubborn in discussions with WoT, but it didn't happen, discussions were fine and interesting to follow

I liked this vid a lot better than the previous one bc there were simply more interesting spots to talk about and also bc I really like WoT's style of playing and he explains his thought processes so well

I don't have any questions, other than if WoT ever wants to give away some more free coaching if he could please pm me, bc that would be hella sweet

I'd love to hear about a few more "what if" scenario's in future vids though

solid video guys. the 3betting discussion was very good.

This is an awesome vid a lot of meat in it. I love the way you two bounce ideas off each other and Wilt is very good at explaining himself even a thicko like me gets it haha!!!

Hielko you sound like a James Bond villain!!

Thank you for this series.

~Scotty

Hey nice vid.

60 min: We 3 bet bberard from blind w/ T7s, and flop a flush draw on AQx

1) Wilt recommends a smallish 1/2 pot bet size here, leaving room to 3 barrel sometimes. How often and against what opponents would be good to 3 barrel here? Doesn't seem like a board that most people would call two streets, and then fold river.

2) If our flop bet gets raised, do u fold or ship? Mathwise, it seems like a fold unless we have a decent amount of fold equity. Generally, is it best to bet small in spots like this, leaving ourselves room to fold, as opposed to pricing ourselves in?

3) How do u like the thought of making a large cbet, and then shoving turn? A.E. Jones recommends this as an alternative (he likes the 1/2 pot approach as well, but finds it more difficult to employ well), where u can simply push turn w/ monsters and draws. He dislikes the standard 2/3, 3/4 pot cbet (although i think some really good players do this as a default). Not sure what is best mathematically. Curious what u think about the different 3 bet pot cbet sizes, generally.

Peace

Also, 77 hand at end of vid was interesting. We defend against tag who 3 bet in blinds. We float a A 6 8 flop, and decide to bet 240 into like 320 on a 9 turn, and u say we priced ourselves in.

You said we have decent equity even when we get it in, and that we probably have good fold equity since we'd expect him to bet an ace to protect his hand.

1) Is this a mandatory bet? We're gonna have only a little over 20% equity at best when he goes with it. Seems kind of spewy to put in over 100bb's there. What about checking and betting river regardless of whether we improve, allowing us to draw for free, while retaining similar fold equity?

Also, how would u compare just pushing (417 into 320 or whatever) instead of betting 240. Maybe looks stronger (but maybe not). I guess the smaller bet allows u to save money, though on ur pure bluffs.

2) Similar to above post. Generally, when we have some equity (but not a ton when called), do we prefer making a committing bet? Say we bet 1/3 pot in this hand, intending to fold. Like say we were super deep- obviously then, it would seem pretty bad to just shovel 500 bb's in or whatever instead of making a small bet and folding if priced out. Always been curious about this since I started NL, but never really got a good answer. What is generally best in spots where we could make like a 3/4 pot bet or whatever (pricing us in w/ a draw) or a slightly smaller bet, but having to fold if pushed on?


Cool vid. Ima go get some sushi!