Sugar Nut
Time Link to 00:09:00
Great points here,
many people will just close their eyes and say: "A pair on the flop? From My Cold Dead Hands!" The thing here is though, that I'd be MUCH MUCH more likely to call a flop bet with 43s than with JTs. Yes, our BDFD gives us 5-ish % more equity, but if you weigh that against all the RIO we have if we hit a J, we're doomed here vs a guy who's at least decent and bets into 3 people on AT3r. OK, I haven't played 25NL on ages, and back then many people would just cbet because they were the PFR, no matter the preflop action, amount of callers etc, but I doubt that these days this is still the case. Poker education has gone a long way since and microNL players know way more than they did back then.
This however leads to an amount of paranoia in the games that makes people never fold a pair, EVER! With the amount of spewtardistic KRANTZ, WHITELIME, FWF etc vids out there people seem to forget that folding is still the most profitable move in NLHE (and that the above mentioned know WAY more about the game and their opponents and can pull off all that spew and be profitable).
I've taken a 2 months break from poker altogether, including any forums, and this is my first post on DC after this break. When I came back to the games a few days ago I couldn't believe my eyes. The games have actually gotten MORE paranoid than before (as if they hadn't been paranoid enough already).
I am, and will remain being a proud folder, and I'm FAR FAR away from being a nit. In fact I'm pretty LAGgy myself, just in a different way than many of my opponents, but the place to elaborate on that is not this thread.
EDIT:
Hahaha, I had paused the vid at the timestamp of my link and wrote my reply. Now I have to disagree a bit. the 5% equity of BDFDs are NOT insignificant. In fact JTo on this flop when the PFR bets into the firld is the easiest fold ever. with JsTs we can at least think about calling, even though we'll come to the conclusion that it's not gonna be a good call. 5% go a long way in many spots. Unfortunately this is not one of them.
Steve,
I know what you mean, but I felt the need to clear that up a bit for the micro grinders here. When I switched over from limit to NL in 2007 I'd always talk about hands like this: So i have middle pair with a backdoor OESD. Pure NL players that had never played limit always looked at me a bit weird thinking: "WTF is he talking about these insignificant backdoor draws?"
Backdoor draws ARE important. However we'll have to get good at knowing WHEN they make a hand continueable (lol, is that an actual word?) and when they don't. In the end it'll come down to experience, and devotion to learning theory and the friggin MATH of the game.
I know, that you can distinguish between the two, but many micro-grinders will hear you say BD draws are insignificant. Believe me, these words will be the ones that'll stick in your mind when you're learning by watching vids. I'm talking from experience here.
I recognize that I'm ranting a bit here, and don't anticipate many people actually reading all of this, but whatever, I felt the need to actually say something on my return to the forums.
I'm happy tp be back.
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