zenben
1270 posts
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Time Link to 00:50:03
Re. Bet/folding (to minraises esp) being difficult to do-we can learn a lot about our opponents by watching hands that we aren't active in, and a river raise is a spot where I ALWAYS make a note-not so much on the raiser, but on the original bettor. 1st, we should note who is and is not capable of bet/folding. If they bet/call, note what they are calling with. If we review the hand and the villain was clearly beat by the river raiser's range, we can make 1 of 2 pretty solid assumptions: Either they are not thinking about their opponent's range accurately (if at all) OR they are not disciplined enough to follow through with their plan. In EITHER case, we should immediately look for ways to exploit these weaknesses and make a note NOT TO BLUFF RAISE these players and to instead VALUE BET/RAISE vs them.
If the original bettor bet/folds, we can't be sure if he was value betting thin and making a good fold or betting as a bluff, but I like to note something like "capable of thin value bets??" so I keep my eye on that player as someone who may be hand reading.
One other suggestion I want to pass on that I heard from a video by DC coach BoSoxx34 (who apparently learned the technique from Tommy Angelo) is that if you find you are having trouble following through with your plan to bet/fold, many of the online poker sites provide a little box you can check that says "fold to any bet." After you bet planning to fold, checking this box will prevent you from making a bad call if you know his raising range beats you. (of course, be careful vs players who may exploit this by bluff raising or if you feel you COULD profitably call a smaller raise!) Eventually, you may not need to check the box anymore, but at first it can be helpful to build discipline.
Posted over 1 year ago
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antique_pub
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RapidEvolution
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Re. Bet/folding (to minraises esp) being difficult to do-we can learn a lot about our opponents by watching hands that we aren't active in, and a river raise is a spot where I ALWAYS make a note-not so much on the raiser, but on the original bettor. 1st, we should note who is and is not capable of bet/folding. If they bet/call, note what they are calling with. If we review the hand and the villain was clearly beat by the river raiser's range, we can make 1 of 2 pretty solid assumptions: Either they are not thinking about their opponent's range accurately (if at all) OR they are not disciplined enough to follow through with their plan. In EITHER case, we should immediately look for ways to exploit these weaknesses and make a note NOT TO BLUFF RAISE these players and to instead VALUE BET/RAISE vs them.
If the original bettor bet/folds, we can't be sure if he was value betting thin and making a good fold or betting as a bluff, but I like to note something like "capable of thin value bets??" so I keep my eye on that player as someone who may be hand reading.
One other suggestion I want to pass on that I heard from a video by DC coach BoSoxx34 (who apparently learned the technique from Tommy Angelo) is that if you find you are having trouble following through with your plan to bet/fold, many of the online poker sites provide a little box you can check that says "fold to any bet." After you bet planning to fold, checking this box will prevent you from making a bad call if you know his raising range beats you. (of course, be careful vs players who may exploit this by bluff raising or if you feel you COULD profitably call a smaller raise!) Eventually, you may not need to check the box anymore, but at first it can be helpful to build discipline.
Awesome post, for sure! I'd add that someone who is capable of bet/folding the river may be someone who is betting a non-polarized range on the river. These players are few and far between in the micros and we should definitely make a note of it. Spots when we're checking to induce a bluff on the river (from a range that will mostly be air/missed draws) won't be as profitable against these players.
Posted over 1 year ago
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zenben
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Awesome post, for sure! I'd add that someone who is capable of bet/folding the river may be someone who is betting a non-polarized range on the river. These players are few and far between in the micros and we should definitely make a note of it. Spots when we're checking to induce a bluff on the river (from a range that will mostly be air/missed draws) won't be as profitable against these players.
Thanks for this great point. I had not thought of that, but we should be considering every possibility when we don't have the added info of seeing a SD. Since we shouldn't be inducing bluffs from these non-polarized bettors, do you have any advice on how to best profit from this betting style? It may depend more on their aggression level VS a bet, such as whether they are more likely to call a bet with their entire "bet when checked to range" (unlikely) or fold their medium strength hands (or raise thinly). I would think we would want to value bet more thinly vs these players since we can't bluff catch or induce bluffs, but if they are playing their medium strength hands aggressively, we may just prefer trying to play them when we have position and opt to check behind when they check (since by default, they either have a weak or polarized checking range and are unlikely to ch/call with worse). I suppose we still face a difficult decision when they lead the river and we have a marginal made hand, however...
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RapidEvolution
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Thanks for this great point. I had not thought of that, but we should be considering every possibility when we don't have the added info of seeing a SD. Since we shouldn't be inducing bluffs from these non-polarized bettors, do you have any advice on how to best profit from this betting style? It may depend more on their aggression level VS a bet, such as whether they are more likely to call a bet with their entire "bet when checked to range" (unlikely) or fold their medium strength hands (or raise thinly). I would think we would want to value bet more thinly vs these players since we can't bluff catch or induce bluffs, but if they are playing their medium strength hands aggressively, we may just prefer trying to play them when we have position and opt to check behind when they check (since by default, they either have a weak or polarized checking range and are unlikely to ch/call with worse). I suppose we still face a difficult decision when they lead the river and we have a marginal made hand, however...
The answer will usually be to either adjust your value-calling range OTR, or start taking more aggressive lines when facing a river bet. For example, if this kind of player can make a thin vb on the river, that means that really strong hands (or at least hands that can call a river raise or shove) make up a smaller % of his overall range and we can start turning those marginal SD value-value hands into bluffs. One of my previous coaches put it to me like this (and I'm paraphrasing).
"In most of these spots, we don't have a hand that can profitably call a river bet to bluff-catch, but due to his range, he also usually doesn't have a hand that can call a big raise...so we should make one"
This isn't something I recommend doing a whole lot at the micros because most of the field is incredibly call-happy AND most players' betting ranges are pretty polarized on the river, so turning a made hand into a bluff is usually unnecessary. However, against the right opponent, it can be a great move and increase how difficult it is to play against you (which is always good) 
Posted over 1 year ago
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zenben
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RapidEvolution
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RapidEvolution
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You can apply more pressure or just give up, based on reads and board texture. As with everything else, you need to balance fold equity (which will be based on the reads you have on your opponent and the board texture) and pot equity (figuring out how many outs you have to hit the a better hand than your opponent). If you know someone will always showdown with an overpair or TP hand, then it's best to just give up, or not even attempt the bluff in the first place (depending on how much of his range is comprised of those hands).
Posted over 1 year ago
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