Episode Four

Get the Flash Player to see this player.

Episode Four

Josh reviews a 4-tabling $100NL video from DeucesCracked member yeahgoforit at (whoooooooooo!) Party Poker.

tags: sthief09 $100nl 4-tabling video review 6max

This Series: King for a Day

Ever wonder what it would be like to have an Executive Producer review your play? Stop wondering. sthief09 lets you sit on the throne for a day as he analyzes member videos.

Previous Video: Episode Three | Next Video: Episode Five

Subscribe to Subscribe to this series Subscribe to this series



Comments for Episode Four

Sugar Nut
Pair of Deuces
100 posts
Joined 03/08

Starting to watch now. Looking forward as always with Josh's videos.

OT question @ Marcos: You have notes on yourself?? WTF??? And how is that possible anyway? When you right klick yourself @ party you just get the option of displaying your stats.

Posted May 27, 2008 12:48pm

fantabox
Deuce High
10 posts
Joined 02/08

The 87o hand at 09:00
When we know the limp-reraiser has a super strong range, there has to something to be said about implied odds?
Calling 3,5$ to almost always win about 70$ when we flop two pair or better. Obviously we never put any more money in without flopping good.

Posted May 27, 2008 1:25pm

tubasteve
Quad Deuces
1994 posts
Joined 11/07

notes on himself prob come from hold'em manager

Posted May 27, 2008 2:14pm

Sugar Nut
Pair of Deuces
100 posts
Joined 03/08

Yeah, I guess one could also edit the notes.txt, but what sense would that make anyway?

Posted May 27, 2008 2:37pm

SlimboKarvell
Deuce High
35 posts
Joined 01/08

Nice vid, good play and some interesting sports (e.g. checking with flopped 2 pair).

Posted May 27, 2008 2:45pm

SSankarAA
Deuce High
24 posts
Joined 04/08

i think its annoying when u americans keep saying things like 'full tilt is no where that soft at 100nl'

i played nl200 on party for 3months. pretty much destroyed it... i just moved to pokerstars this month, and its much much softer.

The regs are extremly easy on stars, party has no FPP whore, most reg put you in tuff spots EVERY hand. i have stars/ftp regs that have wateched me play on party and they think its massivly crazy.

And there is as many 60% vpip fish on both sites.

Posted May 27, 2008 3:33pm

Lewto
Deuce High
47 posts
Joined 01/08

So true Sankar, I can play @ Party too, but I play @ Stars.

Now FullTilt is a terrible place, I agree.

Posted May 27, 2008 4:15pm

Sugar Nut
Pair of Deuces
100 posts
Joined 03/08

I have to agree with SSakarAA on that one. You guys from overseas seem to remember the "Good Ole Days" pre UIGEA.

Party Poker pretty much just like any other site was WAAAY softer back then.

You wanna know why? Because bucketloads of recreational playing AMERICAN FISH were playing there!

The USA have a long Poker history and culture and I assume that a lot of people have played in some sort of home game or occasionally made a trip to Atlantic City or Vegas way before the "Moneymaker Incident" in 2003. Most of these players, however, have never even read a single paragraph of a poker book nor would they even care to do so.

Over here in Europe it's a little different. Before 2003 hardly anybody even knew that there are other forms of Poker than 5 Card Draw (which was simply called Poker over here).

Yes, Moneymaker and the following international hype have created a lot of european recreational playing fish but due to training sites/forums and the "revelation" that it's a math based game which one can actually beat and make a big chunk of change this very hype also created a lot of decent, solid, good, great and crushing european regs.

With the advent of the UIGEA pulling 100% of the american fish out of most sites and 80%-95% of them out of the few remaining (amercan players accepting) sites Online Poker in general got a lot harder to beat.

Beatable, yes. But no comparison to pre UIGEA.

Sugar Nut

Posted May 27, 2008 4:20pm

kondor101
Set of Deuces
466 posts
Joined 02/08

Another great video :)

I am really enjoying my DC membership more than ever, between king and late night I am learning so much, and it is showing at the tables.

(about this off topic euro sites vs usa sites convo)
I have thoughts on this, if someone wants to start a thread on general discussion I will gladly join in. But not here.

Posted May 27, 2008 4:46pm

Sugar Nut
Pair of Deuces
100 posts
Joined 03/08

You're right.

http://www.deucescracked.com/forums/4-General-Discussion/topics/4340-Ongoing-discussion-from-King-for-a-Day-EP04-Euro-sites-v-USA-sites

Posted May 27, 2008 5:03pm

sthief09
Exec Producer
Set of Deuces
308 posts
Joined 07/07

The 87o hand at 09:00
When we know the limp-reraiser has a super strong range, there has to something to be said about implied odds?
Calling 3,5$ to almost always win about 70$ when we flop two pair or better. Obviously we never put any more money in without flopping good.



87o is just too trashy. and sometimes we need to protect us from ourselves, if that makes sense. when you flop top pair, some thoughts sink into your head. "top pair is pretty strong." "what if he just has AK?" even if you could play it perfectly, I just don't think 87o flops tons of equity often enough. even when you flop 2 pair you're not a lock to win:

Board: 8h 7c

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 28.697% 27.87% 00.82% 177702 5256.00 { AA }
Hand 1: 71.303% 70.48% 00.82% 449346 5256.00 { 87o }


and trips:

Board: 8h 8c

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 13.101% 13.10% 00.00% 71592 0.00 { AA }
Hand 1: 86.899% 86.90% 00.00% 474888 0.00 { 87o }


so it'd be one thing if when 87o flopped big, it flopped our opponent almost dead. but he'll often have some equity, cutting our implied odds significantly.

Posted May 27, 2008 5:42pm

sthief09
Exec Producer
Set of Deuces
308 posts
Joined 07/07

I didn't mean to offend anyone regarding Party. I don't remember what I said. All I know is he was sitting at some good tables, and that I love that interface. I know the biggest part of the game deterioration has been the American fish who now either think they'd be doing something illegal illegal, or just don't trust it. but I don't claim to have any clue how soft Party games are in general.

Posted May 27, 2008 5:44pm

Entity
Founder
Quad Deuces
2798 posts
Joined 11/06

I didn't mean to offend anyone regarding Party. I don't remember what I said. All I know is he was sitting at some good tables, and that I love that interface. I know the biggest part of the game deterioration has been the American fish who now either think they'd be doing something illegal illegal, or just don't trust it. but I don't claim to have any clue how soft Party games are in general.



You just said you love watching Party poker -- and the same goes for the rest of us. The interface is what we grew up on, spent years on, built our bankrolls on, then we got the boot. So I still love seeing their default tables to this day (and I think that's what you were alluding to).

Posted May 27, 2008 6:44pm

caderousse
Deuce High
39 posts
Joined 01/08

These are still pretty good but a live play video in here would be nice. You talk about so many things because you can pause the video but when we're playing, there's no real way to translate that into like 15 seconds of decision making thought process. I enjoy the post-analysis but there's still a lot of good to see in watching an instructor make a decision in real time.

Posted May 27, 2008 7:11pm

Sugar Nut
Pair of Deuces
100 posts
Joined 03/08

caderousse,

I have to say yes and no to your post.

Yes, we don't have the time to pause the action while playing, so live videos give us a chance to listen to the thought process in the heat of the battle.

What you forget, though is that thorough postgame analysis (especially when this analysis is brought to us in such a brilliant way, as Josh and other instructors here at DC are doing) is what makes you more confident and most importantly FASTER at the tables.

If you thoroughly analyze your own sessions and listen to analyzes by expert players here you will recognize certain situations as being somewhat similar to spots you have seen before by pausing the action. You are then able to transfer this similar situation to the one currently at the table and all you have to do is find what is different to the situation you have seen before and make your decision instead of thinking it all through from the start.

DC offers live play videos and postgame analyzes. Both formats are great and important in my opinion.

Sugar Nut

Posted May 27, 2008 7:28pm

johnnyson
Deuce High
38 posts
Joined 02/08

These are still pretty good but a live play video in here would be nice. You talk about so many things because you can pause the video but when we're playing, there's no real way to translate that into like 15 seconds of decision making thought process. I enjoy the post-analysis but there's still a lot of good to see in watching an instructor make a decision in real time.



what exactly do u gain from seeing an instructor click a certain button within his 15seconds and then giving a quick not detailed explanation of why he clicked that button lol

Posted May 27, 2008 8:05pm

caderousse
Deuce High
39 posts
Joined 01/08

what exactly do u gain from seeing an instructor click a certain button within his 15seconds and then giving a quick not detailed explanation of why he clicked that button lol



Are you seriously this dense and you need me to spell it out? What you get is a real time response. Sthief said it himself in the opening of this video. When you have a vid and have seen it you have a certain results-based biased.

Are you really saying that having an infinite time period to think about/make a decision would have no impact on the QUALITY of your decisions?

Look, I just threw my comments out there. They ask for input, I gave mine. I know there are a lot of people who look at the SLIGHTEST criticism/suggestion and freak out. For those people, I say "Oh well". I could just be a sheep and say "5 stars no matter what you do I'll love it!!!" or I could give a real feedback. You have the right to disagree, but it doesn't invalidate my opinion at all.

Posted May 27, 2008 11:05pm

yeahgoforit
Deuce High
53 posts
Joined 03/08

Hey guys, I don't know but someday I put a note on myself by a bug on party's software. Couldn't grab it out since then.

Posted May 28, 2008 12:37am

sthief09
Exec Producer
Set of Deuces
308 posts
Joined 07/07

Hey guys, I don't know but someday I put a note on myself by a bug on party's software. Couldn't grab it out since then.




it happens when you export notes from Poker Tracker, specifically when you export stats. there hasn't been a need to do this since HUDs though so not sure if that's what it is

Posted May 28, 2008 2:18am

yeahgoforit
Deuce High
53 posts
Joined 03/08

Just watched the video, I really love the speed on the dead time. The 37 hand I really don't remember what was going through my mind since it's been a month since I did the video. But overall I think I played fine and would like to thank sthief for spotting some mistakes that I will work on.

Love DC, that's it.

Posted May 28, 2008 2:31am

johnnyson
Deuce High
38 posts
Joined 02/08

Are you seriously this dense and you need me to spell it out? What you get is a real time response. Sthief said it himself in the opening of this video. When you have a vid and have seen it you have a certain results-based biased.

Are you really saying that having an infinite time period to think about/make a decision would have no impact on the QUALITY of your decisions?

Look, I just threw my comments out there. They ask for input, I gave mine. I know there are a lot of people who look at the SLIGHTEST criticism/suggestion and freak out. For those people, I say "Oh well". I could just be a sheep and say "5 stars no matter what you do I'll love it!!!" or I could give a real feedback. You have the right to disagree, but it doesn't invalidate my opinion at all.


sthief also said himself that he didnt view any of the videos before analyzing them, and this was only the case for this one because he lost the initial recording.

selective memory ftw eh? dont call others dense when ur too retarded to remember 30seconds of intro.

oh and its fine for you to criticize, then also take others criticism of your suggestion tough douchebag

Posted May 28, 2008 5:40am

sthief09
Exec Producer
Set of Deuces
308 posts
Joined 07/07

no more bickering please. the beauty of this site is that we recognize everyone learns differently. some learn best through lecture type videos, some through live play, some through hh review. we offer all that. sometimes we mix it up within one series. sometimes we stick to one format. live play doesn't fit my strengths so I tend not to do that. if you're looking for ssnl live play, there are a bunch of standalones. videos a few months old are still absolutely worth watching. movin' on up features a couple of ssnl videos that are great too.

Posted May 28, 2008 8:54am

duffte
Deuces Full
524 posts
Joined 04/08

the midstakes nlhe forum needs some more support any maybe you want to post some hands yourself? thatd be awesome

Posted May 28, 2008 9:25am

jenol
Deuce High
6 posts
Joined 05/08

Wow I really do not agree with you on the 89hh hand. I can't see why flatting ever would be good against any type of player on the flop? And what is that about waiting to get your equity up? We want to get payed by flush draws, AA etc which we wont if a scary turn comes and every turn is just weird to play. I think your logic is very flawed here. Anyways overall nice video

Posted May 31, 2008 12:18pm

Magaca
Pair of Deuces
108 posts
Joined 01/08

Hi Josh! The video is great, tons of good info etc etc.

However you sometimes seem to get so swallowed up in a hand that you miss other important hands on other tables, and don't go back to them.

For example, at ~36 mins, you are focused on the AThh hand in a 3-bet pot on table one that you miss a hand at table three where marcos 3-bets AKs BBvsCO and c/f a 883 flop. I would very much like to have heard you're comments on that. :)

Great vid, but please be more aware of this in the future. :)

Posted Jun 2, 2008 11:05am

jgunnip
Deuce High
91 posts
Joined 01/08

Wow I really do not agree with you on the 89hh hand. I can't see why flatting ever would be good against any type of player on the flop? And what is that about waiting to get your equity up? We want to get payed by flush draws, AA etc which we wont if a scary turn comes and every turn is just weird to play. I think your logic is very flawed here. Anyways overall nice video



kinda late but say you are villain in this hand and you know that hero is a solid regular. How likely are you to give him credit for a flopped two pair on this draw heavy board if he flats and then raises a blank turn? Are you more or less likely to stack off w/ AA or AK if had raised the flop on this board?

Obviously it should be a standard play, but you also shouldn't just be auto-raising this flop without considering how calling might effect the outcome of the rest of the hand.

Another good vid Josh. I'm catching up on this series before I watch part deux this season and am very much enjoying it.

Posted Jul 18, 2008 10:50pm

Trillos
Deuce High
8 posts
Joined 06/08

Sthief. I know im in late, but i really want to hear about the hand you played around 26.55, where you said you would prefer a checkraise on the river. Our opponent is loose and passive, so i think a bet should be best?

Posted Jul 21, 2008 7:22pm

sthief09
Exec Producer
Set of Deuces
308 posts
Joined 07/07

Sthief. I know im in late, but i really want to hear about the hand you played around 26.55, where you said you would prefer a checkraise on the river. Our opponent is loose and passive, so i think a bet should be best?




I replayed the hand. betting is the safe play, but checking gives him a chance to bluff or make a bad pairbet that bad players tend to do ("i have the best hand so i bet") and get himself stuck if we raise. the whole 120 is probably too much but if we've been playing aggro at him, which i noted there, he'll call it off with a lot of the hands we'd bet. a raise would be 5 or 6 times as big as a bet so it only has to work 1/5 or 1/6 as much

Posted Jul 21, 2008 10:43pm

Trillos
Deuce High
8 posts
Joined 06/08

I replayed the hand. betting is the safe play, but checking gives him a chance to bluff or make a bad pairbet that bad players tend to do ("i have the best hand so i bet") and get himself stuck if we raise. the whole 120 is probably too much but if we've been playing aggro at him, which i noted there, he'll call it off with a lot of the hands we'd bet. a raise would be 5 or 6 times as big as a bet so it only has to work 1/5 or 1/6 as much



Thank you.

Good videos all around btw

Posted Jul 23, 2008 8:06pm