dude. an entire ep in rhyming couplets would OWN.

shrewd, an entire ep of climbing chuck bets was shown.

Fwiw I was really happy with the way this one came out. Nice to show some spots where players are folding and how to actually create FE in LHE.

Yes and no. I still like the looser games, they are better/easier. This was more educational value imo (hopefully!)

Was showing Karen, my SO, the video I was watching. At 20:11, the hand came up with Danzasmack holding AKo on the button. Villain had 77 UTG and raised and D 3 bet, winning on the river with Broadway after 3 diamonds came on the turn. I told her to reverse the seats and have ChukDiesel play the 77.

The flop comes Qc3dQd.

Danza checks. Villain bets and D c/r. Villain calls. Villain wouldn't have 3 bet AQ, and doesn't have QQ since most-likely he wouldn't smooth-call here with QQ or AA or KK, but he might.

Turn is Jd. Danza bets out with his 77, again, knowing that JJ is not likely from this villain 3betting pf, and when he doesn't get raised, he knows Villain doesn't have the one hand he may have AdKd. 77 is probably still good, even if villain calls, which is unlikely, even if he peeled the c/r.

River is a lousy card, the T. Danza knows there isn't a hand V would have 3balled that hasn't gotten there. AK. D checks, villain bets and Chukdiesel saves a bet by folding.

So, given the Theory of Reciprocality, Danzasmack makes money by winning with both hands more often than villain, and loses less $ with both hands, so D is the winner all the way around.

I explained this to my SO, who's now run into the bedroom to pull out the rest of her hair.

Nice job, D.

CJ

Hey Danza,

When I first saw this episode I got upset, because I play these stakes, and thought that playing like this is not going to get the money. So I quit the series and tried to find other vids. After posting about it, people convinced me to finish it, since it would be instructive anyhow. So that's what I'm doing now.

I made notes while watching your video, it's a list of plays I don't agree with. I didn't edit these notes, so I don't expect you to reply to them. Moreover you already commented on them during play, and you made the context clear. Still I don't see how a lot of these are +EV.

I'm going through the video right now to provide another perspective since I know I play a bit more snugly than danza. It could actually make for a great thread if DD would do the same (I'll ask him later today) because right now, you're taking a very confrontational stance ("I don't see how this is +EV") rather than stating why you think it's -EV, in a lot of these cases. Honestly, from reading your post -- if I had to guess -- I'd say you're WAY too tight postflop (and probably preflop) and are probably playing your cards far too often as opposed to thinking about ranges and how your opponents will deal with you. In order to learn to beat higher games you're going to have to start experimenting with a lot of plays like this, which very closely walks the line between spewy and brilliant. It really is necessary, and I'm not using hyperbole here. That said, on to the hands.

2nd hand: 2:10: call 56o in SB after one limper.

This is pretty standard for me. It's not that it's not close, it's just that in a 1/2 structure you can expect to take down the flop a fair portion of the time by betting out on some board textures that don't hit limpers (K82, K37, etc). If you elected to fold it, I'd say "ok" and move on but I don't think calling here is bad unless you're playing 100% fit-or-fold with it. The price isn't good enough to fit or fold but you can make a lot of money by stealing small pots from bad players who play their hand strength too often and don't use aggression to their benefit.

22:05: open raise 42s in SB vs bad player who doesn't fold much. Too weak.

I agree. This is bad.

24:37: 3bet QTs in SB vs tight HJ open raise. Why not fold?
or call to let bad BB in?

Calling is bad -- your hand does play well multiway but you'd rather have initiative+dead money than no initiative and have your hand look exactly like what it is. By 3-betting you take down the pot when it's A76 and your opponent has KQ, etc. The reason you 3-bet PF is because against tight players, despite their tight preflop ranges often they fold too much postflop (this is a clear problem with a lot of otherwise good thinking TAG players, and one of their hugest leaks in general. Personally I'd fold this in this spot, and you can hear in Chuck's voice that he was thinking about doing it. Make the 22/16 one position later and it's a good 3-bet. Chuck talks about why he 3-bet there. The logic is important, even if you disagree.

3 ways on AQ9r flop, bet, 2 calls. Turn 3r, check, 2checks,
river 4: why not bet?

You need to be good > 50% of the time vs both of their calling ranges. River is a c/f expecting balzer to have Ax frequently or Doktor to have KQ and not fold to a bet once you check the turn. River c/f > c/c~=b/f > b/c.

25:12: openraise 96s in CO?

Pay more attention to the game and less to your hand. 60 hands and the player on the button is 12/9. SB is 22/17 (never defends SB) and BB is 25/17. Opening any two is probably close to correct with this specific lineup (I'd say opening 60% of your hands here is fine). Choosing to equalize it by having some suited/connected value so if you do get called you have some play postflop is ideal. 96s is fine (normally this is loose).

29:10: openraise 75o on button vs unknown sb and loose BB
who doesn't fold flops?...

Loose BB? He's 10/7 preflop. INSANELY tight. This is a 100% steal preflop. In LHE, people fold the SB easily (as they often should) and the BB will check-fold a lot when he does decide to call.

29:50: open raise 87o in CO?
2 ways on K74ddd flop, bet, call
turn 7, check check, -> why not bet and capitalize on aggro image?
(ok new player, but still)

You don't really have enough hand to bet-3bet the turn (it's close but I think you'll be up against slowplayed flushes too often) and most singleton diamonds will bet to protect thinking you're giving up. C/R is probably close to bet there but the thing about c/r the turn more often you have a great chance of getting your opponents to float you less on the flop and bet the turn less often (more free cards for you!).

30:10: open raise JTo UTG 5handed? After all this laggy play? Isn't image
more or less established already?

Once again, capitalize on tight tables by widening your range. It's not an image play. That said I think it's a muck here because the seat on your left seems to be calling too much preflop but QJo is an insta-raise here so JTo isn't that far behind.

2nd table:

35:17: 3bet KTo on button to unknown CO openraise 5 handed?

Pretty standard in 99% of spots for me. I almost never fold this OTB to a CO raise.

43.15: open raise J9o UTG 5 handed?

I agree, bad adjustment here. 43/21 and 43/14 on your left. In the other game this is an easy raise though.

50:00: AKs in SB 3bet to loose passive UTG raise, who caps.
Board: 7557T. Checkcalldown. Is it possible to fold the river (8:1)?

45/17 is not passive. 45/17 is actually quite aggressive. Anyway, river fold is pretty meh given that the pot is so huge.

51:00: AdTho open raise in CO, button 3bets, flop Kh8d4h. Why peel?
(getting 9:1. So what?)

You call because you also call and c/r sometimes with KQ, 88, etc. If you always fastplay your good pairs a peel is pretty meh here. As is I peel with the Ah and fold without it, so I fold here but you call the flop because you can actualize your showdown equity vs hands like A9, QJ, JTs by calling the flop because some of those hands give up postflop.

53:30: 3bet AJs in SB after tight HJ open raise and CO cold call.
Isn't calling much better? Isn't this hand going to SD
somehow give that the pot is so big (no Fold Eq.), don't
you figure to have an inferior hand to openraiser?

I'd call here though if the openraiser were more like 16% PFR a 3-bet is fine. You 3-bet because you want to fold BB (dead money) and force Skittle to play fit or fold postflop which he seems to do, getting HU with kodybui and lots of dead money in the pot and a bad player you're HU up against.

flop: K66, betcall openraiser's flop raise. Isn't that spew?

How is that spew? You're getting 15:1 with about 3.2 outs or so. Sometimes he's retarded with 88 and 99 and gives up, so you get a free look at the river. I'd call and fold the turn.

1:00: 3bet K3s on button vs CO openraise? You do mention 'light 3bet',
but what is the point of this at this stage. 'aggro wins',
why not go even further then?

Chuck didn't 3-bet here, he just openraised. Taking advantage of a player who limps preflop to get dead money in the pot with initiative. With the blinds here I think it's bad with K3s but I'd do it with Q8s+, K7s+.

So, while I'm still not thrilled, I do find value in the video since it shows what aggression CAN do. (for good and for worse: you win pots someone more passive wouldn't win (for example the KQs hand in the sb that you 3bet (not in list, because it's well played!), and win for 1 bet on an Ahigh flop, but you lose pots someone more passive wouldn't even be in (KTo 3bet hand, where you end leaving a lot of bets at the table. In my opinion, totally unnecessary. So what we need is a more balanced style of play: making these plays from time to time, and trying to find the best spots to run over opponents, but not make them for the sake of it, like this video seems to suggest at first glance, and which might inspire some people to do.

I think your comments and the fact that you thought about a lot of this are great, and I think you're going to hate Oink's vids a ton more if you hate this one, but honestly I really really really strongly encourage you do to more thinking about ranges and how hands play postflop when certain preflop actions are taken. My personal read is that you seem to be playing a very solid, snug game but it's an unfortunate truth that that won't lead you much beyond $2/4 or so. Learning when and how to loosen up and get in pots with bad players is a necessity for succeeding in higher stakes games (and by higher stakes, I really just mean anything beyond $2/4) and I hope you continue to look at these vids to challenge yourself and ask more about the WHY when Chuck does something you hate, because from my look over his vid, he played very well albeit a bit loose at times, but nothing that should have set off any bells -- maybe just challenged your thoughts a bit.

hope this helps,
Rob

Wow Rob! You took a lot of time over that answer.

Good stuff.

Yeah I actually have to say at this point, thank you VERY much to Peesocake for not only talking about the spots that bugged him, but noting the time stamp at each. It made it very easy for me to find my way through the vid while I watched and made the response a lot easier. Hopefully we can kick off some interesting discussion about TAG vs LAG play and why being a LAG is a lot better once you get used to it (even though I think I'm still more TAG at heart -- no way can a 31/22 player be considered LAG when you look at Oink by comparison). :)

Rob

Hi Entity,

Woah, thanks a lot for replying in such detail. It's been worth all the effort already :).

I don't like the sentence you used: "which very closely walks the line between spewy and brilliant". I mean, it's a nice sentence, but jee... I guess what I find hardest to determine is, what is spewy but lucky, what is brilliant but unlucky. It's like putting your head in the ocean and trying to tell which fish eats which.

I do want to recomment some hands:
""
29:10: openraise 75o on button vs unknown sb and loose BB
who doesn't fold flops?...

Loose BB? He's 10/7 preflop. INSANELY tight. This is a 100% steal preflop. In LHE, people fold the SB easily (as they often should) and the BB will check-fold a lot when he does decide to call.

""

Yeah, he's 10/7 preflop, but his fold BBtoSteal is 22 (at least that's what I thought this stat meant right there). So it looks like he almost never steals a blind, and wonders why people steal his, so he defends. I mean, I would like a better hand than 75o, the value of which comes from stealing the blinds outright. And I don't see him folding his BB.

""
35:17: 3bet KTo on button to unknown CO openraise 5 handed?
Pretty standard in 99% of spots for me. I almost never fold this OTB to a CO raise.

""

I guess this is a spot I have a lot of trouble with. 99% standard? I would need to know the openraiser is a loose openraiser, before I 3bet KTo. In my mind it's very aggressive play that needs information on the opponent, on his postflop play too. There must be many of these spots...



""
43.15: open raise J9o UTG 5 handed?

I agree, bad adjustment here. 43/21 and 43/14 on your left. In the other game this is an easy raise though.

""

But in the other game, you said that JTo is borderline (while QJ is instaraise, I agree). And now, it's J9o. That should be instamuck, then.



""
50:00: AKs in SB 3bet to loose passive UTG raise, who caps.
Board: 7557T. Checkcalldown. Is it possible to fold the river (8:1)?

45/17 is not passive. 45/17 is actually quite aggressive. Anyway, river fold is pretty meh given that the pot is so huge.

""

OK, but his AF is 0.56. Yet he bets the whole way. Wouldn't he just check Ahigh behind, fearing that you're calling him down with a PP, and knowing that you'll call this river anyway with Ahigh for a chop?



""
flop: K66, betcall openraiser's flop raise. Isn't that spew?

How is that spew? You're getting 15:1 with about 3.2 outs or so. Sometimes he's retarded with 88 and 99 and gives up, so you get a free look at the river. I'd call and fold the turn.
""

I'd actually bet/fold the flop, especially since Ernemann calls your bet. Skittle then raises both of you. You only have ace outs, and that might not be enough. No backdoor. Ernemann, might be slowplaying a 6, forcing you to fold the flop after having paid 2 bets (unlikely though). But like you said, I might be too tight postflop. I do think Skittle has the K though.


Yeah, and the K3s hand, my bad...


All in all, you do agree with me on about half the hands... And I understand your final comment. Loosening up in the right situations, and think about how certain hand ranges play on certain flops. I'm very happy you said that, because it's something I will definitely work on. I'll try to not be too spewy hehe :)


Again, thanks a lot for you time.

Peesocake