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Poker Video: MTT/SNG by bones (Mid Stakes)

WTG Panch!!! Watching atm...

Wow I need this vid. My graph like a rollercoaster.... own the 6.50s... get owned at 16s... rinse repeat! Links seem dead to me right now but cant wait to get it!

There were a lot of very interesting spots on the first games played. Too bad the recording didn't come out. Hope the questions I asked during his play & my reflections on moving up helped someone out there. It's been great to watch the vids & read the forums here & making a move from $3.30's up to the $16's. By the way I don't recall this coming out on the video but I DID take a stab at the $27's & had to move back down to the $16's so it almost turned out to be about a higher move up in the buy in's. Thanks Bones for having me on the video. By the way you did manage to get the 4 screens almost perfect on this recording.

Thanks for helping out with the vid, Pancho. As far as the sizing goes, Rusty is pretty awesome at editing and fixing my mistakes, so no clue if that was me or him getting it right.

Do you guys like having members as guests in the vids? I had planned on having a few more guests in upcoming vids, but if you guys would rather solo vids I can work with that as well.

I like having members as guests in vids very much because there's a dialogue between the teacher and student or expert and amateur, wich I believe is very valueble.

I like having members as guests in vids very much because there's a dialogue between the teacher and student or expert and amateur, wich I believe is very valueble.

I agree. Definetely is a +EV to have DC members as guests in vids.

Time Link to 00:58:42

Why don't you shove J5o from the button here? Seems to me like stack sizes are just about perfect for it, and our hand is not total garbage.. I'd push just about ATC in this spot because both players have to call fairly tight.

Hey Bones, I was wondering if you could link me to the HUD program you use for SNG's. I can't seem to find one, I find a bunch of different programs for it though. If you could link me to the exact one you have it'd be much appreciated.

Time Link to 00:38:35

What was the reason for pushing all in with 66? Was it because of how tight the players where? Didn't quiet catch onto it.

Why don't you shove J5o from the button here? Seems to me like stack sizes are just about perfect for it, and our hand is not total garbage.. I'd push just about ATC in this spot because both players have to call fairly tight.

I agree that it might be a shove and I wouldn't argue against it. As far as J5o not being total garbage, it's in the bottom 30% of hands and has 32% equity vs a huge calling range (22+,A2s+,K9s+,Q9s+,J9s+,A2o+,K9o+,Q9o+,JTo). A hand like Q6s, which on the surface seems quite similar, has 38% equity vs that same range. It's a big difference.

What was the reason for pushing all in with 66? Was it because of how tight the players where? Didn't quiet catch onto it.

It was just to cover the reasoning rather than to just do it and left it unsaid. With 13.5bbs, a lot of players will make it 3x and try to figure out what to do if shoved on. I wanted to explain that I prefer shoving over raise/folding or raise/calling and why. I feel like that's a spot where a lot of low stakes players run into some confusion because of the "shove if you have <10bbs and raise otherwise" convention that has been spread through the sng community over the years.

It was just to cover the reasoning rather than to just do it and left it unsaid. With 13.5bbs, a lot of players will make it 3x and try to figure out what to do if shoved on. I wanted to explain that I prefer shoving over raise/folding or raise/calling and why. I feel like that's a spot where a lot of low stakes players run into some confusion because of the "shove if you have <10bbs and raise otherwise" convention that has been spread through the sng community over the years.

This was exactly one of my questions I think from the previous session I believe. Where I would raise then be like "what now?". Good leak to plug.

Time Link to 00:42:10

bottom left: I consider this shove with KQo a bit loose, isn't it?

I think it's fine and probably standard.

Time Link to 00:53:56

On the left table calling a shove here w/ A4o would be absolutely terrible no matter his shoving range. To justify a reshove he'd have to be raise/folding a ton, which isn't very likely in my opinion. I'm very surprised bones thinks this is so close.

On the left table calling a shove here w/ A4o would be absolutely terrible no matter his shoving range. To justify a reshove he'd have to be raise/folding a ton, which isn't very likely in my opinion. I'm very surprised bones thinks this is so close.

Yeah, it's not a call and didn't mean to give the impression that it was super close or anything.

1:01:40 -> fold AQ in BB with 7.5BBs to SB push?? to make that call not profitable his range would have to be (AK, QQ+). and i think even a somewhat tight range for him (since he is a regular trying to win) would be (A8+,KJ+,22+). its deffinetly a leak in one of our games but im not convinced its mine.

1:01:40 -> fold AQ in BB with 7.5BBs to SB push?? to make that call not profitable his range would have to be (AK, QQ+). and i think even a somewhat tight range for him (since he is a regular trying to win) would be (A8+,KJ+,22+). its deffinetly a leak in one of our games but im not convinced its mine.

erm... Even if he is shoving ATC here, we have to fold AQo! Just because of the fact that we are in a prretty good shape and there are two very short guys left at the table, which means our TEQ is really high atm and we don't wann risk getting busted by calling here.
We have to fold AK (suited or not) as well, no matter what his shoving-range look like.

Great video. Really good questions Pancho, you asked a couple things I was wondering about.

Great video. Really good questions Pancho, you asked a couple things I was wondering about.

Thanks. I was hoping to play & have Bones sweat me, but since I play at Bodog it was dead (no games for me to play) at the time. I'm glad the questions I asked were of help to others. I figured I'm not alone in trying to continue to move up the buy ins.

hello

I am watching this video and I have a question about push folding. I am new to SNGS i used to play 2nl and a friend told me I should play 1$ SNGS instead. I played my first one in over 6 months today and I came 3rd.

I just played tight ABC poker and I just played my big hands.

But in your video your are raising all in when it is folded to you. I was wondering if you could just raise it something like 4XBB to achieve the same effect. I feel like raising all in with something like king 3 is very marginal and I wouldn't like to do it. Although I know you would be only raising king 3 when the blinds are weaker and don't play back at you as often.

Thanks for making this video it has help me a lot. Even tho I still only play 1$ 90 mans

Pancho,

I was wondering if you would share how you do ICM analysis on your Bodog games.

Are you just manually entering hands?

I just sent over a handgrabber game to SNGwiz and they are taking a look to see if it has all the relevant info needed for analysis. When they looked at it last (~18 months ago) it was missing some key info.

Too bad about not being able to get some Bodog specific feedback. The push fold strategy covered in many of the other videos is not as helpful when you get down to bubble play, and the average VPIP of the three remaining people is greater than 40%.

"Spite" calls are more common from other players than pushing on the button in the late game. And sometimes the monsters are not there to value bet them.

Thanks again, and try to keep those "Getting Bodoged"s to a minimum.

Pancho,

I was wondering if you would share how you do ICM analysis on your Bodog games.

Are you just manually entering hands?

I just sent over a handgrabber game to SNGwiz and they are taking a look to see if it has all the relevant info needed for analysis. When they looked at it last (~18 months ago) it was missing some key info.

Too bad about not being able to get some Bodog specific feedback. The push fold strategy covered in many of the other videos is not as helpful when you get down to bubble play, and the average VPIP of the three remaining people is greater than 40%.

"Spite" calls are more common from other players than pushing on the button in the late game. And sometimes the monsters are not there to value bet them.

Thanks again, and try to keep those "Getting Bodoged"s to a minimum.

Hello! This is PanchoStern but I'm using my wife's account. In any case I DO enter the hands manually. I have trouble with HEM & any other software for my Bodog games. I can't even do graphs etc on my HEM as they show almost reverse date (like -90%+ ROI etc) which is way way WAY off. In anyone happens to know how let me know. I think it probably has to do with the Idleminer Bodog Hand Grabber. Works great for getting the HUD to work though.
Actually I've been looking into leaving Bodog & moving to another site as I'm not getting rakeback there & the site refuses to give me any to point I was told to go "somewhere else" which I think I will.

PanchoStern,

Thanks for the info.

I sent a hand history in the text of an e-mail to SNGWiz and they asked me to send over some actual files earlier today. Since it was not a definitive "No" after first review, I am cautiously optimistic. I will keep you updated.

I unfortunately am in the same boat about rakeback. But other parts of playing Bodog just seem to have allot of exploitable areas I want explore before moving on.

At this point they are at least offering matching of up to $600 for monthly deposits on existing account. Released $1.00 per 10 pts. It does not matter much to me since I am still learning while two tabling $5's, but depending on your volume, it could add up to real money over time.

I have the same graph problem with HEM. I am OK with keeping my own graph, but the messed up sorting in reports by BB is a real pain for me. I am hoping that HM may do some work on it since PT3 now has native Bodog support. I just got HM3pro and hate to have to make another purchase.

PanchoStern,

Thanks for the info.

I sent a hand history in the text of an e-mail to SNGWiz and they asked me to send over some actual files earlier today. Since it was not a definitive "No" after first review, I am cautiously optimistic. I will keep you updated.

I unfortunately am in the same boat about rakeback. But other parts of playing Bodog just seem to have allot of exploitable areas I want explore before moving on.

At this point they are at least offering matching of up to $600 for monthly deposits on existing account. Released $1.00 per 10 pts. It does not matter much to me since I am still learning while two tabling $5's, but depending on your volume, it could add up to real money over time.

I have the same graph problem with HEM. I am OK with keeping my own graph, but the messed up sorting in reports by BB is a real pain for me. I am hoping that HM may do some work on it since PT3 now has native Bodog support. I just got HM3pro and hate to have to make another purchase.

Yes, Let me know how that turns out. I AM wondering if the PT3 works good there or not. I love my HEM though & honestly don't know how much longer I'll be playing there. If I wasn't crushing the $16's I would be long gone. Let me know when you are on I'd like to sweat you on your games. I'm sure I still remember some of the regulars at the $6.50's. I started down at the $3.30's.

Time Link to 00:47:54

For those also concerned with HUD real estate, consider either getting rid of the labels, or at least abbreviating them more. V for VP, P for PFR, A for AF, SD for WTSD, etc. HEM hud also allows abbreviated player names and if you set the decimal on them to 2 it only shows three letters - very helpful. Also, you don't usually need a label for Hands either. After doing all of this, I would suspect that the HUD in this video could be condensed to 3 lines at most.

Also, don't be afraid to play around with fonts and font sizes. There are fonts that are actually easier to read at say 8 point than some others are at 9 or even 10 sometimes. Finally, remember that you can often (at least in HEM and PT3) put spaces in the box where you are supposed to put your labels - you can do this instead of labels. This puts a little more space between the stats which also helps with quick reads, etc.

Yes, Let me know how that turns out. I AM wondering if the PT3 works good there or not. I love my HEM though & honestly don't know how much longer I'll be playing there. If I wasn't crushing the $16's I would be long gone. Let me know when you are on I'd like to sweat you on your games. I'm sure I still remember some of the regulars at the $6.50's. I started down at the $3.30's.

For what it's worth, I actually have both PT3 and HEM. I use HEM almost exclusively, but I use PT3 at Bodog as there is no additional software required and it works well in general. Then I might just import those hands into HEM for analysis. I realize that having both is not a good option for many people and am not suggesting anyone go buy both, but just relaying my own experience.

As a side note, I also keep a Shortcut on my desktop to the hand history folders of various sites so I can quickly access those folders without digging into the system much. This makes it easier to quickly import into HEM, delete a quick and silly freeroll before HEM tries to import it, etc.

Hey bones at 42:48 you mentioned that you like to filter your hands on the HUD to 9/8, 7/6, 5, 4, 3 handed, and heads up. I was wondering exactly how you do that on holdem manager.

HUD Option ----> Additional HUD Filters

time 57.35

hi bones, i'd like to know the reason of the shove with QTo, because on S&GW it seems pretty close, requiring really tight calling ranges to gain a little EQ profit. are you willing to use the bubble aversion to confrontation, as strategical factor, over ICM considerations?
in this spot i would have folded: is this a leak?

time 59.25

same question as above.

thx

time 57.35

hi bones, i'd like to know the reason of the shove with QTo, because on S&GW it seems pretty close, requiring really tight calling ranges to gain a little EQ profit. are you willing to use the bubble aversion to confrontation, as strategical factor, over ICM considerations?
in this spot i would have folded: is this a leak?

time 59.25

same question as above.

thx

They're both on the thin side, but I expect them to be calling very tight. Folding isn't a leak, but I tend to err on the side of aggression, especially with a chip lead on the bubble.

Do you guys like having members as guests in the vids? I had planned on having a few more guests in upcoming vids, but if you guys would rather solo vids I can work with that as well.

I enjoyed frank being in the video and I think that it is a great idea to have members as guests. Having an average member as a guest is a great way to get information because we will be closer in thought than a coach. The coaches here are great and do well on explaining plays and giving many examples, but sometimes when you reach a higher level of knowledge you forget the silly thoughts or questions you once had.

I thought bones did a great job with this video and I look forward to watching the rest of this series. There was a ton of information in here to help me with my SNG play. Among the top were all the thoughts on shoving and the HUD player filtering settings.

I also thought Frank did a great job at asking questions. His comment about how valuable he thought the stat Won $ At Showdown is was priceless information for me and I'm adding it to my HUD immediately.

Since this is my first post here I would just like to say I think EVERYONE at DC is doing a great job and I'm excited to get to know the community.

Hey, thanks for the feedback. I enjoyed doing that video & wish I could have played & have had Bones critique my play, but unfortunately I was playing at Bodog at the time & couldn't get any tables loaded. Having said that I really enjoyed participating in the video. Glad my comments were appreciated. I've had several members tell me that they liked the questions I asked. I had so much stuff I wanted to ask & had a blast.

Time Link to 01:01:30

I don't understand why SB should push atc here with 3rd and 4th place so small. Seems to contradict advice from vandweller's flying blinds video I just watched, according to his advice it would be a clear fold.

I don't understand why SB should push atc here with 3rd and 4th place so small. Seems to contradict advice from vandweller's flying blinds video I just watched, according to his advice it would be a clear fold.

I haven't watched that vid, but sb should be shoving against me to force me to fold pretty much everything (precisely because 3rd and 4th are so short). It would be much different if stacks were reversed, but I can't imagine past vandweller advocating folding as sb there.

OK thanks I will go over the videos and see where I'm not understanding and also it is going by his SB chart which he does say doesn't cover every situation.

Time Link to 00:19:07

H
Could you recommend some hand ranges according to position and tournament phases.
I see that you fold 55 and AJo