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Hi I'm really sorry for the simple one here... but I'm basically just looking at the reasons for and against betting this flop when checked to.

The reason I'm a little dumbfounded by this bet because I would expect the UTG raiser to c-bet most of his broadway hands and his pocket pairs on this board... not doing so is quite passive... So I'm not sure what he's checking here... and I'm not sure what I'm getting value from if I bet...

But what I DO know is that my 88's doesn't benefit from a free card here nearly as much as one of the other guys if they're looking to check call over cards here... and if I have the best hand at the moment, which is likely given the 2 checks in front of me... I need to be charging them $ to outdraw me.

So this looks like a bet for some value (UTG c/c AK/AQ/KQ etc) + getting them to fold good amounts of equity despite mostly folding worse hands...

Again sorry for the dumb question but I'm seriously looking to lock down my betting or not thought process while I stick suck at the pokerz.

Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

Hero (BTN): $11.60
SB: $12.47
BB: $7.90
UTG: $3.46
MP: $9.85
CO: $8.66

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BTN with 8 8
UTG raises to $0.20, 1 fold, CO calls $0.20, Hero calls $0.20, 2 folds

Flop: ($0.75) 7 2 T (3 players)
UTG checks, CO checks, Hero bets $0.40

Hey stanmore i play 10nl as well just started 6max cash games. I think you should either 3 bet pre to get heads up and have a better chance at the pot or if you flat your probably just set mining with a middle pair against two opponents. So im not sure how i feel about betting out especially at 10 nl i noticed most people dont give much credit and they will call with as little as two overs and you dont have much equity when called and your in a gross spot if the turn is an over card. If they are complete fish though betting could be good.

Easy bet (assuming PFR would bet set, overpairs and top pair):

1) We can get called by worse hands
2) A lot of bad turn cards so we want to take it down now

I mean... I basically agree with Adriano because of the two reasons stated...

Like my options are check it or make a bet here...

The funny thing here is that the very same hands I'm getting SOME value from, basically 2 over cards type hands... are the ones I'm thinking of when I'm considering how vulnerable my own hand is when it IS currently the best hand...

So I get the least out of checking and seeing the turn for free IMO... I'd be giving them a free shot at binking me on the turn.

Also the 2 checks in a multiway pot are usually more honest than being checked to in a HU pot so I was less worried about being check raised than I would've been with just the two of us in the pot.

Hey stanmore i play 10nl as well just started 6max cash games. I think you should either 3 bet pre to get heads up and have a better chance at the pot

You don't think 3-betting pocket 8s vs a UTG opener is spew at 10NL? People call out of position a lot, much of the time one or two overcards will flop and you'll be in a pretty tricky spot. If we flat obviously we're happy if we flop a set, but we have medium showdown value which we have a good chance of getting to the river if our opponents are not too aggro and it's not going to be super hard to get away if we see aggression.

Stan, I bet/fold here and expect to win it on the flop a lot. I don't like your sizing though. Into two people I think you need to bet more (probably 55 or 60) to make them scared. Then when they fold you can type "I played it like a set" in the chat. Just kidding about that part. But if their broadways, low pocket pairs and diamonds are only going to call once, you make a lot more by making it a bit bigger.

If one person calls and the turn is not an overcard or a diamond I would often bet/fold again thinking they will often either have a pocket pair or two broadways they floated the flop bet with(perhaps with a diamond or two). If your opponents are passive/stationy and both call the flop I would expect the turn to get checked through often on a blank and you can decide for yourself whether there's more value to be had (probably not).

If it ever got to the river I don't think I would ever bet and I probably also wouldn't call any normal-sized bet.

I think you should either 3 bet pre to get heads up and have a better chance at the pot or if you flat your probably just set mining with a middle pair against two opponents.

I'm not sure I'm that big a fan of 3betting an under-the-gun raiser with 88's...I can expect to be 4bet plenty and have to fold them... or if he calls post flop I'm in a bloated pot with a medium pair probably looking at over cards knowing a check will often be a check raise. ...and playing them for set value/position multiway isn't going to be too bad.

(for the record... I'd 3bet worse hands... )

So im not sure how i feel about betting out especially at 10 nl i noticed most people dont give much credit and they will call with as little as two overs and you dont have much equity when called and your in a gross spot if the turn is an over card.

Those factors are I think decent reasons to bet... If they have overs they have 6 good outs against me and as such are about a 3:1 dog.

Should I NOT be charging them to see the turn?

Also, on the "don't have much equity when called" yeah I'm a favourite right now when called against anything that isn't a 10.. like JT has me crushed... But the UTG raiser would have been looking to check raise AA-JJ on this board if he checks the flop... so him check-calling AA-JJ is very unlikely.

So that leaves AT and JT, both of which I would discount some given his UTGness (particularly JT but you never know).

So when I'm check/called his most likely hand is 2 overs... which I have drawing to 6 outs.

I don't think your hand warrants a bet - play around in pokerstove and try to come up with a plan for when you get raised, and what kind of spots you end up in on turn and river. Think it's very difficult to play even though your in position. Check back and bet the turn when checked to again strikes me as a better line - since at 10NL people play straightfoward even though it might not appear that way

THE TURN

Now I'm feeling a little more confident in the bet...

I'm now wondering if I would bet again when checked to on a blank turn (if I was called on the flop)... given my impression of their check/calling range on the flop... on a blank turn I'm not going to win the most by betting again... as I'm expecting those over cards to fold to a turn bet now...

I'm actually going to do better checking back to induce river bluffs on blank rivers. My line will look to Ace-high like I was stabbing at the flop and have now given up...

Any merit in those thoughts or is that crazy talk?

Why not write it out Stanmore e.g. exactly your equity on the flop and what you're achieving with your bet against their range and than your plan for the turn for each card, etc. I'm sure it will be interesting to dissect the hand that way

Why not write it out Stanmore e.g. exactly your equity on the flop and what you're achieving with your bet against their range and than your plan for the turn for each card, etc. I'm sure it will be interesting to dissect the hand that way

Yep I'm definitely going to do that. I'm going to bed now but I'll play a shorter session tomorrow and spend some time nutting out this kind of spot...

Your betting flop for protection and value...its def a easy bet....turn can be played any way you want....your not gonna induce bluffs on river by che king turn....gonna most likely induce a weak calldown and get thin value from a weak bluffcatcher....you can manipulate villains range here with betsizing.and get a go?od note also.betting turn isn't that bad niether is checking to induce light call Downs..
.just think of best line vs villain...


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Yes, go with the thin value bet. We can get called by 7x hands, flush draws (although some can be flips)), and to fold out overcards that have 25% equity or so.

Why not write it out Stanmore e.g. exactly your equity on the flop and what you're achieving with your bet against their range and than your plan for the turn for each card, etc. I'm sure it will be interesting to dissect the hand that way

i really dont think this is verry necessary... (i dont even think its possible to write out a range for UTG & CO since they both seem to be fish)
imo its making the hand way harder then it actually is, and t hats pretty easy.
bet the flop when checked to, bet close to all turns when checks to, i would check behind turn A or K, probably betting all other cards.
the moment you get raised its a super snap fold.
easy game

I'd like a clearer explanation from those who believe this is an easy bet. I'm at work so don't have any tools at my disposal, but on this board, against UTG and CO multiway pot, I guess our equity is prolly 35% or even less. When we bet, I don't think we're getting many folds from their combined range, and as such we're more likely to value own ourselves in the hand than to get value out of a worse hand. Secondly, when we do get folds, it's all the junk that we were ahead of in the first place. Thirdly, on the turn on the majority of cards our equity will drop, there will be a lot more draws and we'll have to make a more difficult decision in an inflated pot and all of this only because we feel compelled to bet our pocket pair that might be best on the flop... this board I'd bet sets and FDs and I'd bet both of them big and barrel them a lot. Pocket pairs you can't take that line because you have show-down value, thus best to check it back I think?

@EUSSI sounds like what I call betting and hoping to get called by worse. Really you should have some kind of an idea of what hands your opponents play, how they play them, and what the best course of action is. Not just bet for the sake of betting and check fold river or when raised.