Micro Stakes Online NL Poker Forums

hi,

I have a question concerning the winrate in cash game in general. I play mostly micros and my winrate is around 8,5 bb per 100 over 15000 hands ... I know it's not a large sample size, but what is the average winning rate and when can I move up limits...

I think that is a pretty good winrate by any measure. I think another goal should be to try and win consistently also. I am kind of in the same boat, and moving up in stakes slowly. Personally I am more concerned with playing better poker than just my bb/100, although bb/100 is of course a huge indication of how one is doing compared to others. Basically it means that you are probably playing better then most other players you are up against right now. The people who are really making money at poker have been doing this for years, and are extremely good. It takes a lot of work and time to get to their level.

Also if you aren't making a few mistakes here and there, maybe you are not pushing yourself far enough outside your comfort zone. Of course in poker mistakes cost money, but that is why we start off at micros so our mistakes only cost us a little bit of money, as opposed to a lot of money. Learning something for $5 now might save you $50 when your at the 50NL level.

Personally I make way more per hour at my job than poker. But I think getting better at poker is more a long term deal than a short term one. The idea of sitting at my computer, and earning money doing something challenging is something I dream about a lot... Some people make unbelievable amounts of money at this game, but they have put in a tone of work. I like to get really really good at things, and poker is a new challenge for me. I expect it to take me 5 years or so to master poker. I am already getting good but mastery takes a long time. But I think it's such a great goal, and the rewards are so huge.

Also I think it's better to do what you feel is right, then to look at some measurement. I think the question is really, do you think you will be profitable, and can you afford the price if you are wrong. What other people think doesn't mean anything at all. And if you spend some extra time at a lower stake, who cares, the goal is to get better, and you should not worry about too much what other people do.

Your winrate is on the upper end. In fact with only 15000 hands you may very well be running hot.

Moving up is really more of a personal decision, but if you have the roll and are confident I say do it.

I'm going to give a different perspective than xsAir. I make more outside of poker too and realistically always will. Use that and be aggressive moving up. If poker isn't your sole source of income than be more aggressive in your shots. Take a couple buy in shot. If it doesn't work move down. If you stick great. Better than playing 5 nl for months and find out you find out you were good enough the whole time to beat 10nl.

Focusing on learning is the right focus, but you'll learn more playing a stake higher.

I think playing the really tiny stakes (lower than 25nl ) actually teaches you bad habits in the long run(unless you aren't planning on playing higher). Part of the reason is the competition. The other reason is the rake. You are paying a ton of bb to play those stakes. When you pay the amount of rake you do at those stakes it means there are a bunch of spots where you have to fold because the rake makes playing parts of your range unprofitable. It's really hard to be aware of that and adjust properly until you get really good at the game.

I think playing the really tiny stakes (lower than 25nl ) actually teaches you bad habits in the long run(unless you aren't planning on playing higher). Part of the reason is the competition. The other reason is the rake. You are paying a ton of bb to play those stakes. When you pay the amount of rake you do at those stakes it means there are a bunch of spots where you have to fold because the rake makes playing parts of your range unprofitable. It's really hard to be aware of that and adjust properly until you get really good at the game.

Could you please elaborate on hand ranges.vs rake that's something I do not understand well.

Read http://www.deucescracked.com/blogs/ashthepro/41361-Love-me-some-Micros-
]Love me some Micros! by AshThePro.

As for rake, someone suggested on the forums to top up your bankroll by what you paid in rake each month. Seems like a sensible idea if you want to move up.

I think playing the really tiny stakes (lower than 25nl ) actually teaches you bad habits in the long run(unless you aren't planning on playing higher). Part of the reason is the competition. The other reason is the rake. You are paying a ton of bb to play those stakes. When you pay the amount of rake you do at those stakes it means there are a bunch of spots where you have to fold because the rake makes playing parts of your range unprofitable. It's really hard to be aware of that and adjust properly until you get really good at the game.

I agree 100 percent in that my game has to change when I am playing 4 or 10 nl from when I am playing 25 or 50 nl. My stats change, my ranges change, the whole game is different in reference to your competition comment. On paper, my stats at 10nl prob look bad but they allow me to win the 8bb or whatever over very large sample. My stats at higher stakes are significantly different but obviously my wr is smaller. I feel event though crushing the iddy bitty stakes is cool, it does alter your game and you have to be concious of that when moving up. when there is a min raise and 5 callers, sometimes its ok to call from the bb with jto or whatever which leads to random stats and a different mindset as how to approach the game. anyway, 8bb is good so move up if you have the roll op.