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Also if you make a slightly -EV play early on in a session like for example if you feel villian is polarized on the river it could be very profitable to bluff catch with say A high. People at the table wont realise that villian was polarized they will just think you are a donkey and it can make the rest of your session very +EV.

I feel calling "like a donky" in there eyes on the river makes you look way worse than a failed bluff to them.

I don't really think you need a larger roll just because usually live players aren't that great. It just seems like there is a lot more variance because you play a lot more MW pots and a lot fewer hands. I've some pretty extended streaks both with winning and losing sessions but like Shuttle said if you can play MW pots well, you should do very well.

You definitely need a much larger roll than you would think, regardless of the competition. Preflop pots will regularly be much larger than online like 30 to 40bb, in turn making cbets rather large, causing a lot more variance than you would think. All you have to do is get coolered/sucked out on in a few huge pots and not flop anything and fail at a few cbets, and you're down $1k like that.

When I first started playing live I started a thread and the general consensus was that a $1k bankroll is more than enough for live $1/2 lol. Just today I lost two 300bb pots with topset vs. a runner runner bdfd and with QQ vs. 63o which called $85 blind preflop and shoved the flop on a 965r board. Stuff like this can EASILY happen for a few weeks straight, so playing under-rolled is a ticket to busto-ville. Obv it's different if you don't need the money for anything else though.

You definitely need a much larger roll than you would think, regardless of the competition. Preflop pots will regularly be much larger than online like 30 to 40bb, in turn making cbets rather large, causing a lot more variance than you would think. All you have to do is get coolered/sucked out on in a few huge pots and not flop anything and fail at a few cbets, and you're down $1k like that.

When I first started playing live I started a thread and the general consensus was that a $1k bankroll is more than enough for live $1/2 lol. Just today I lost two 300bb pots with topset vs. a runner runner bdfd and with QQ vs. 63o which called $85 blind preflop and shoved the flop on a 965r board. Stuff like this can EASILY happen for a few weeks straight, so playing under-rolled is a ticket to busto-ville. Obv it's different if you don't need the money for anything else though.

Yeah like me i have a real job i started with 1BI 2x a month (so technically i started with 2BI) and built my roll from there now i am semi rolled for 2/5 (25BI ATM)

I have no living expenses, i am 22 and live with my parents.

great points...keep em coming haha

I play with at least 100BB when I sit down. Online I am probably more LAG, but when I switch to a TAG type player. This is because people call 3 bets very light, pay you off if they have top pair, and really don't have any sort of positional strategy. Just try to take advantages of big pots and don't get too fancy. Bluffs can be made, but are much harder to pull off.

Bluff a player in a small pot and show it, then go for huge value n a big pot against same player and they ofen will pay you off. Online, it's easy to forget about a bluff or a hand that happened a little while ago, but if you bluff someone a a live table they never forget. Even a week lawr they are likely not o give yo credit.

This is obviously bad players only, there are still decent live players but they are easy to spot, and most people at 200 or 300nl are pretty bad.

You definitely need a much larger roll than you would think, regardless of the competition. Preflop pots will regularly be much larger than online like 30 to 40bb, in turn making cbets rather large, causing a lot more variance than you would think. All you have to do is get coolered/sucked out on in a few huge pots and not flop anything and fail at a few cbets, and you're down $1k like that.

When I first started playing live I started a thread and the general consensus was that a $1k bankroll is more than enough for live $1/2 lol. Just today I lost two 300bb pots with topset vs. a runner runner bdfd and with QQ vs. 63o which called $85 blind preflop and shoved the flop on a 965r board. Stuff like this can EASILY happen for a few weeks straight, so playing under-rolled is a ticket to busto-ville. Obv it's different if you don't need the money for anything else though.

Yeah I agree. My point was basically that I don't think you need anything crazy like 50 or 100 BI like some online pros might like to have. I would never recommend anyone play with less than a 20 BI roll unless it is simply no big deal to replenish.

I don't know how it is in vegas/atlantic city or other live poker areas, but at my casino, unless the villain is one of the worst players there or rather drunk, raising preflop and then betting big post flop with one pair hands (e.g. TPTK or overpairs) will cause you to fold out all the hands you are trying to get value from or valuetown yourself most of the time. Obviously this has implications for bluffing turns and rivers with huge bets, something I intend to start experimenting with.

But the moral of the story is to pay attention to your competition, because there's a reasonable chance that most players are super loose preflop and super MUBSy post-flop, meaning you have to make your value bets a lot smaller in proportion to the pot than you do online.

Another thing I have been playing with is running some silly bluff in a small pot in your first couple of hands and showing it. Like say 4 guys limp, you make it huge like $22 with T3o, you will get folds most of the time. Show the bluff, and people will think you are bluffing them and will start calling down like online fish. Two things I don't like about this though is that a) if you don't make any hands you can't take advantage of your image and you will end up losing most pots because your cbets won't work and by the time you do get a hand it could easily be a few hours and everyone could have forgotten about your image or left the game already because of how slow live poker moves and b) you don't really know how *everyone* at the table perceives you and it's hard to figure it all out when you only get like 40 hands and hour and when there are 9 other players, so if you get raised by someone you don't have a strong read on, it's hard to know if they are playing back and if you should go broke with a hand like TPGK or if they are not trying to adjust at all.

Some very good points in here and a lot of live games I have played play very similarly. You see a lot of guys that will pay to see the flops and will just play fit or fold/ scared post-flop. I often feel like I get slow-rolled when someone just calls on the river with the 2nd nuts. I also agree with making smaller value bets because people don't really notice the size of the pot and think more in terms of monetary value. As AGTJ said, this is especially true with TPGK type hands. You have to be careful not to value own yourself. That said, just like online, it's not that unusual that you will come across a complete station.

In regards to making a small bluff to create image, this is an interesting idea. I would just make sure that you are disciplined with this and keep doing in spots where it isn't costing you a lot in the case something goes wrong. I've tried 3betting in some spots where I thought it was a good idea to create some image, but in hindsight a lot of these plays were just spew. I end up waiting 3 hours before I actually have another good sqz/ 3-bet spot and by this time there are a bunch of new players or no one remembers anyways. It just can become tough with playing so few hands per hour.

Basically just reiterating a lot of AGTJ's points, but a lot of good stuff in there. Good post as always.

best advice imo is to not about poker with anyone at the table. It's really hard not to spazz out, when other players start 'discussing' a hand... Just allways be nice, talk about the weather etc. ... and slowly take their money. You don't have to go get it, as it is online, you just have to sit still and wait until they'll hand it over to you.

cheers for the reply folks