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Cool story bro. Let me know when I should care about what you post/think.

Someone ban this idiot

Do a little research on youtube

For something as complicated as nutrition and mental health I may recommend more legitimate sources to review the research and evidence than youtube.

if you need someone to talk to you can always PM me - congrats on taking the right steps, hopefully the doctors can get you on the right combo of medication/therapy to help. it's no easy task as I've known a lot of people with mental illness and it runs in my family.

Eating as healthy as possible is just a good idea in any situation, although I have never seen any evidence linking it to easing the symptoms of bipolar.

That said, best of luck. With treatment, there's no reason to let it hold you back from accomplishing anything.

Bit of a wild story with the doctor giving you bad medication.

Standard in regards to mental health, and especially bi-polar spectrum.



From what I know about bi-polar, eating well/exercising doesn't really bi-polar peoples. + the dogma of "if you have a problem just exercise/eat well!" isn't always +EV advice for those that have depressive symptoms anyway.

GP's in the UK cant really prescribe anything other than antidepressants. So he gave me what he could basically. Only a psychiatrist can prescribe a mood stabiliser.

I approached a doc about depression in 2009 and they told me to eat well and exercise. While it has helped I think my condition has made me become a bit OTT with the whole training regime. Before my first episode I was training so hard I was giving myself headaches and sometimes feeling light headed or groggy after a superset. Looking back it was a bit stupid and unnecessary, I was lucky not to have hurt myself. Im working out again now, but not as intensely and enjoying it again. I used to dread workouts lol

GPs hand out anti-depressants? wow okay, bit different in Australia.

As far as I'm aware, the whole exercise and eat well thing is only good if one is not highly depressed. If they are so, basically they will find it incredibly hard to do so and it only increase to the guilt because they will inevitably fail. It's not as if somebody who has lost all hope in everything and finds it difficult to shower/brush teeth/do anything but sleep can actually sustain exercise/cooking. I guess it depends on how one defines it though, going for a 5 minute walk around the block is manageable for most, but most think exercise as running/weight lifting for a decent amount of time. That dread occurs for even 15 minute runs in some, and some are not as resilient as you are and it's just another activity that crushes their spirit.

It seems what is happening with you is when you're in your mania stage you have lots of energy and motivation, almost a frantic amount, which causes you to go OTT on certain things. When you go through a depressive stage all that probably goes out through the window for the most part. I can't imagine anyone thinking of committing suicide would also be thinking about exercising.

I go OTT with weight training and guitar for the most part and sometimes video games if I really enjoy them, and other things such as alcohol. Sometimes I cant stop being productive and other times, the thought of even getting out of bed and doing daily chores or even preparing food seems like the greatest burden. When those times happen, I dont really do much...just exist really. I dont leave the house for days on end unless I have to for work etc. I just lie about watching stuff on my laptop eating convenience foods and dont play guitar at all or even get in contact with friends. I just want to be alone and make excuses not to go anywhere or do anything.

That sounds like such a tormenting existence, much much worse than I have it, tbh it's fairly textbook standard but(have a interest in Psychology), which blows my mind that the GP didn't ask a few questions to try and gather if you were bi-polar spectrum.

My highs and lows are not quite as bad; my mania is more like just being super happy for awhile and being quite motivated, rather than having a gush of "maniacal" energy, and my depression cycle isn't so bad, mostly because I am used to and content with it, it was very tormenting when I was working/had regular friends, I think being mindful helps, although it's hard when one is feeling like the remains of a toilet after a diarrhea episode.

Greatest of luck to you anyway.

I spent my third year of med school hunting for a circadian rhythm gene specifically to work on clock abnormalities in bipolar disorder. Didn't find it but from that year and subsequent literature I heartily suggest that you maintain a consistent sleep schedule during the night and get out into bright sunlight every day, especially in the morning, and especially near the spring and fall equinoxes. Sleep at night, every night.

Your self-awareness works in your favor. It can be very difficult to treat manic people without hospitalizing them against their will.

Don't be afraid of lithium in the short term. And don't be afraid to taper off the meds after you've been stable a while, but make sure you have independent supervision / someone to watch over you and make the decision to put you back on meds, because bipolar disease often makes people feel bulletproof or so bad such tht they don't want treatment, so you may not be a good judge of when to restart.

Good luck!

Im not sure what the stance with Lithium use is like in the UK. My brother said that since it does not stop the suicidal urges or major depressive episodes in some patients and its still used in conjunction with an antidepressant but the NHS are trying to phase it out gradually. He is on an antidepressant and an anti psychotic which seems to be the more modern form of treatment.

Since being on the antidepressants my sleeping has been really good. It used to be all over the place, last nights sleep wasnt great...well I felt fine, just didnt feel tired until about 5am but still got up and got on with my day at around 9:30 and didnt feel groggy or lethargic. I actually cant sleep in, when I am awake, Im awake. I get out of bed to take my medication then hit the shower and then workout if I am not in a rush. So I am going to make sure that my sleeping pattern stays this way, its helped a lot on its own.

Im delaying what ever medication they recommend until after my exams which finish June 1st. I just cant be taken out for 2 weeks again adjusting to medication when I need to be studying, now just isnt the time.

Thanks for the advice.

+1 on the phototherapy issue, or photomanagment or whatever you want to call it. As far as I've seen though the strongest evidence is a gene knockout study in mice.

Lithium is oldschool in the UK and a last resort because of the supposed more dramatic side effects and higher risk of overdose. Doctors get bombarded with drug rep bimbos doing their utmost to sell the 'atypicals' and bullshitting about research so they are first line now, despite their very worrying side effects. If you're on them you have to accept you will almost certianly end up fat and have the problem of tardive psychosis (a problem ignored/doctors are ignorant of in practice), amongst other problems.

Anyone know the reasons why at times people get tired, as in it's real late, but they don't feel like sleeping? What's with that?

For something as complicated as nutrition and mental health I may recommend more legitimate sources to review the research and evidence than youtube.

In the hope of not sounding too defensive, I am merely suggesting he juice some vegetables and drink them up each day.

Granted youtube might not be the most "legitimate place" to find out unbiased and honest information on many subjects, but IME on the subject of juicing vegetables and making fruit smoothies the information is almost exclusively viable and sound.. That said I am not oblivious to the potential of scammers/snake oil salesmen that maybe want to sell you things that may not be helpful or people with very little knowledge telling you things that maybe incorrect on occasion, but this is extremely infrequent on vidoes posted on this subject IME and in most cases I have seen the complete opposite with people posting with a real depth of knowledge on how the body works and showing great insight into the healing properties of certain vegetables and the best ways to prep[are them coming from people who are clearly extremely fit and healthy. Its not like trailing twoplustwo for poker advice !!

I know this may sound off the wall to you, but im not very keen on the way the FDA/world health authority's have there hands tied by big corporations with regards to what chemicals that are allowed to be used in are food supply, which drugs are to be approved and the way they influence the education of health professionals

So i'll say it again, if you dont juice vegetables or drink fresh fruit smoothies this maybe beneficial with regards to your problem and other areas of your life, and a good source to learn how to do this is youtube.

Peace, Ben.

imo telling someone who is suffering from cyclothymia vs. bipolar disorder to juice vegetables is harmful. it seems harmless, because vegetables are good for you and likely help prevent cancer and perhaps heart disease. but it's bad because bipolar people in the manic phase are particularly vulnerable to superhealth sales pitches, and they may well decide juicing vegetables is all they need instead of seeking care that works.

this illustrates the human fallacy of control over random events. if i just take eichenacea i won't get colds. MMR caused my kid's autism. Airborne will stave off my cold. all of these were vehemently pitched to me on multiple occasions and have been proven wrong. thankfully i did not have to suffer pitches for praying to Ra so the sun will come up or throwing salt over your left shoulder to ward off the devil or whatever the superstition / unproven supplement claim / magical thinking of the day was. these pitches have changed to fit the times, such that now there are elements of plausability. but they're still unproven sales pitches at the human need to believe "if i just do X, i'll be ok." sorry but we all have to roll the dice.

karmabuddy it's great that you have reached out for support.

get a diagnosis from a good doc. go with what is known to work. if you wish to add to that, fine.

imo telling someone who is suffering from cyclothymia vs. bipolar disorder to juice vegetables is harmful. it seems harmless, because vegetables are good for you and likely help prevent cancer and perhaps heart disease. but it's bad because bipolar people in the manic phase are particularly vulnerable to superhealth sales pitches, and they may well decide juicing vegetables is all they need instead of seeking care that works.

this illustrates the human fallacy of control over random events. if i just take eichenacea i won't get colds. MMR caused my kid's autism. Airborne will stave off my cold. all of these were vehemently pitched to me on multiple occasions and have been proven wrong. thankfully i did not have to suffer pitches for praying to Ra so the sun will come up or throwing salt over your left shoulder to ward off the devil or whatever the superstition / unproven supplement claim / magical thinking of the day was. these pitches have changed to fit the times, such that now there are elements of plausability. but they're still unproven sales pitches at the human need to believe "if i just do X, i'll be ok." sorry but we all have to roll the dice.

karmabuddy it's great that you have reached out for support.

get a diagnosis from a good doc. go with what is known to work. if you wish to add to that, fine.

Ok fair enough, I see your point. Good advice

I saw the psychiatrist again today. I am Bipolar II with rapid cycling, the psychiatrist has been very good throughout this process. He also said that since I have only had one full blown manic episode, that he is reluctant to put me on a mood stabiliser at the moment since I seem to be doing a lot better on the anitdepressants which they are going to review again in 6 weeks after my exams are finished. I have had far more major depressive episodes than manic episodes and a lot of my mania tends to be hypomanic in nature. The depression seems to be the most destructive part of my condition, so he has put me on the waiting list for CBT and I will be seeing him on a pretty regular basis from now on.

good for you karma!

rapid cycling and 1 manic episode hey? interesting.

great you're getting CBT!

The full blown manic episode was triggered by the antidepressants after a severe major depressive episode. Peoples moods tend to be elevated naturally after coming out of depression, but with Bipolar types this is hugely exaggerated and is something I have to look out for. The rest of what I have told him and from the notes from the other doctors suggest that the mood swings occur too quickly for it to be Cyclothymia. He says a lot of my mania, is not too severe and more productive in nature rather than reckless and dangerous...something that I also told him that I actually quite like and that the depressive episodes are very severe and concerning because they have been getting worse. He did also tell me of a lot of warning signs to look out for and recommended CBT which I am more than happy to do. Around 20 hour sessions was recommended.

Peoples moods tend to be elevated naturally after coming out of depression, but with Bipolar types this is hugely exaggerated and is something I have to look out for

I didn't know this, cheers


Have you figured out a means of being to play A game poker? If I'm feeling depressed I can't really concentrate at all and am all indifferent to the game, and if I'm hypomanical my mind races so fast I find it really difficult to notice the subtleties, which worked great for MTT SnG because I could 30 table and go aggro at everyone but it ain't so great for cash and I'm so very bored of SnG D: Thinking of getting some incense and playing some nature type music and meditate before I grind if I'm hypomanic, and just steer clear when I'm feeling depressed, which sucks for bonus whoring but eh I'm probably -$EV playing in that state. Maybe get some sort of system to follow where I ask myself a bunch of questions before I click buttons, "what's his range here? what does my range look like" so I slow down the frantic button clicking and create time to think about the spots, idk

You're lucky. I have just been offered 10 sessions of CBT after 11 years of problems, worse than yours. After that I will go private as it is not enough for the range of issues I have.

About 8 different medications have had no positive effects and severe adverse effects. Excessive sedation for months on end and 50lbs weight gain (90lbs the first time) three times. 8 years overweight to obese from medications that did not help me, where I never had a problem with weight before.

Then I read up and studied MH and psychology formally too, and realised why psychiatry is in the abysmal state it is in today. I'm undecided about taking anything and if I do it is not based on any information from a psychiatrist as they are so useless. There are quite a few good books explaining the numerous flaws in the system (even ignoring non academic works), two of the best I listed. Looks like you're a believer though so I won't press on it.

Anyone know the reasons why at times people get tired, as in it's real late, but they don't feel like sleeping? What's with that?

Could be one of a few things. You can be tired but staying up too late in front of a computer screen. The light is stimulating to the brain, meaning that even if you are tired you cannot expect to just turn it off and hit the pillow and sleep.

Alternatively it could be emotinal: if you are stressed or angry you may not be able to get to sleep. I have nights where I can't sleep the whole night simply because I'm angry.

Thirdly it could be you have been to sedentary during the day. etc

Maybe I put forward one question. What do you or your brother think about the low success rate of either antidepressants or antipsychotics in meta-analyses (of the order of 15% above placebo)?

Of course this is ignoring the problems of publication bias and the fact that the majority of RCTs are funded by pharmaceuticals.

ugh that sucks to hear Lelantos; I'd imagine such a ordeal would make one quite bitter indeed

realised why psychiatry is in the abysmal state it is in today

Care to elaborate some? I'm only just about to go through the Psychiatrist loops, any heads up would be lovely. I'm Australian btw, not sure how different it is from wherever you are.