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The oecd has done studies of obesity by country using BMI as the measure. They back up the anecdote about Korea and Japan having very low obesity rates. Lots of online resources link this, but The economist for example is one.

i'm probably wrong then. or too critical when i think any noticeable belly fat = fat.

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index#Limitations_and_shortcomings :

"BMI also does not account for body frame size; A person may have a small frame and be carrying too much excess fat, but their BMI reflects that they are "healthy"."

This thread has really motivated me, I've decided to go all out on LCHF this February to attempt to get rid of my beer gut. I've just taken a before pic front and side so if it goes well I'll report the difference.

This is pretty cool, I love when people try low carb for the first time I've had a bunch of friends try it since I lost a bunch of weight on it and they are all amazed.

Gotta watch onions- a lot of carbs in an onion.

Watch out for Asian food in general- I love Asian food but they seem to work sugar into every single sauce somehow. If it has a sauce you can bet it has carbs, sometimes a shocking amount.

In general your first couple days will be rough- somewhere around day 3 I hit a "wall" every time and I feel like killing someone for a plate of pasta (which I normally don't even eat much of). Get through day 5 or so and you will be amazed at how your apetite disappears- all cravings gone.

My daily diet:

Breakfast (7a.m.):
Coffee + added raw sugar
blueberries mixed with Greek Yogurt
2 scrambled eggs w/a mix of: green peppers, olives, mushrooms, onions, broccoli, sharp cheddar cheese

Mid-morning snack:
At least a handful of nuts (primarily almonds)

Lunch (12pm):
Salad w/a mix of: spinach, avacado, cabbage, beans, carrots, green peppers, olives, parmesan cheese, balsamic vinegar
1-2 small chicken breasts or 1 chicken sausage (no preservatives added)
A small bag of chips (or baked pita chips) w/hummus or homemade salsa: avacado, tomatoes, onions, jalapeno, cilantro, black beans

Afternoon snack (if needed):
More nuts

Dinner:
2 quesedilla (no preservatives, 3 ingredients) w/ cheese, pink salt (I prefer over normal table salt), humus, very small amount of hot sauce (contains preservatives )
or
2 chicken breasts (made different ways for variety - with spices, rarely marinated)
or
Vegetable soup with fresh vegetables w/added chicken breast
and
Salad (similar one to ones above)
and a piece of dark chocolate at least 1 a day (of course with no added preservatives, etc.)

Before bed:
I normally drink a glass of 2% milk (mostly from habit growing up)

On days I workout afterwards I make this rockin shake:
4 ice cubes
2% Milk
Banana
Peanut Butter (made with only peanuts , no preservatives)
Whey protein

I wanted to post this to see what you guys think I might be missing. I also hoped to give ideas for food/ what I do for a daily diet (I like eating these things it's not just to be eating "healthy" ) I know some things aren't the greatest (chips, etc.), but overall I think it's pretty good. I wish I liked fish I tried so hard.

I think I can add more: oils (flax, extra virgin, etc.), red meat (steak, occasional hamburger), more variety of vegetables.

I think I do well in: not eating any type of bread, cereal, limiting my fruit to only small amount of blueberries and 1 piece at night (post-workouts generally), keeping away from trans-fats, hydrogenated oils, trying to keep anything I buy that is in cans/bottles to have as little as ingredients as possible (no preservatives)

[quote


What's you guys feelings on breakfast cereals? I don't mean the sugar coated crap of course. What about:
a) Oatmeal
b) Muesli
c) 100% Wholegrain cereals like shredded wheat.
[/quote]

Whole oats that are soaked the day before is kinda acceptable, but soaked buckwheat is a much better choice. Muesli or cereals is crap for sure.

What's you guys feelings on breakfast cereals? I don't mean the sugar coated crap of course. What about:
a) Oatmeal
b) Muesli
c) 100% Wholegrain cereals like shredded wheat.

Oatmeal, hands down.

I will not be drinking any beer or high carb drinks whatsoever. If I drink any alcohol it's going to be either Bloody Mary, Wine or Jack-Daniels-DietCoke.

Let me know if any of the food list is inappropriate.

Any drink besides water, tea is a marginal idea. Milk and coffee are probably ok for you, but go for raw milk or fermented versions of milk.

iluv68, its kinda hard for others to pass comment/make suggestions without knowing your goals/lifestyle. Can only assume you are a regular gym goer from you mentioning a PWO shake.

Your PWO shake looks fine, how does it taste with ice cubes? I use something similar but never tried ice cubes before...Though I personally would advocate Casin instead of Whey, or at least a blend of the two. Honey would also work instead of PB. I would definately add 35g of Casein Protein to your glass of milk prior to bed.
My PWO shake is:
1 Banana
1 Cup Milk (full cream/fat)
50g Casein Protein (occ. 25g Whey & 25g Casein)
1 Tablespoon Honey

My diet is a bit more full on, though specifically geared to towards my training, my macro breakdown is roughly 350g/400g/120g of P/C/F respectively. Thats roughy 4k calories per day, usually like to bump up to 4.5k per day, split over 4-6 meals, with 2 shakes.

I guess, I am just "living a healthy lifestyle". I have no specific goals in working out other than maintaining a healthy body. I am not training for anything - just keeping baseline fit.

A couple things

1) I fucking hate BMI. It's awful. I'm 5'9" 175# with reasonably visible abs and I'm considered overweight.
2) Unless you weigh like 300#, I don't see any good reason to eat 350g protein/day.

I guess, I am just "living a healthy lifestyle". I have no specific goals in working out other than maintaining a healthy body. I am not training for anything - just keeping baseline fit.

sounds great then!!

A couple things

1) I fucking hate BMI. It's awful. I'm 5'9" 175# with reasonably visible abs and I'm considered overweight.
2) Unless you weigh like 300#, I don't see any good reason to eat 350g protein/day.

1) I 100% agree with you!
2) I 100% disagree with you, I dont recommend it for many, but specific training requires it!

Im obese according to BMI which is loltastic, I have a 32" waist and Im 203lbs

My daily diet:

looks like an obsession with leafy and low fat stuff with very little real, satiating foods. is this an ideal day for you for what you actually eat? i think i'd be angry going to bed on a diet like this...

this is the LCHF thread, you might want to check out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSeSTq-N4U4

not to be too critical since i think your diet is better than most, but we have some very different ideas of what "healthy" eating is.

my macro breakdown is roughly 350g/400g/120g of P/C/F respectively

i'm sorry to hear that. you must work out from dawn to dusk.

2) I 100% disagree with you, I dont recommend it for many, but specific training requires it!

Can you explain? I've never read anything recommending more than maybe 1.2g/# even if you're doing like SS.

i'm sorry to hear that. you must work out from dawn to dusk.

not at all, pretty standard for my stats and goals.

Can you explain? I've never read anything recommending more than maybe 1.2g/# even if you're doing like SS.

SS??? (not sure what that means sorry)

Simple answer: 'Its what works best for me'.
Trial and error over years of training. And this is what works best for me, I do occ. throw in a few weeks of signifcantly reduced Carbs (<20per day) to keep my body on its toes. Im not advocating it for anyone, just thought I'd share, I know its not HFLC. I take my training and nutrition seriously and duely get serious results. Or were you wanting a specific nutrition article that recommends higher consumption of protein??

I've been cutting down heavily on the carbs for the past couple of months, results are good but I'm not sure how much this can be attributed to the low carb aspect of my new diet or just cutting out the processed crap.


What's you guys feelings on breakfast cereals? I don't mean the sugar coated crap of course. What about:
a) Oatmeal
b) Muesli
c) 100% Wholegrain cereals like shredded wheat.

I usually have one of the above along with a protein shake and a piece of fruit.
The rest of my diet is mostly fresh fruit & veg, steak, pork and fish.

I love bacon/sausages but honestly my mornings are so hectic I just don't have time to prepare and eating them every morning would probably turn me off them.
Don't say eggs because I just can't eat them, I'm no fussy eater but I'm 100% sure that and the rest of humanity has fallen for some huge scam

You can pre-cook bacon or sausages and microwave them for decent results. My wife is really good about prepping stuff like that and then I am more likely to eat healthy even if I'm busy / have to be somewhere.

For anyone eating HFLC, this is a lifesaver:

http://www.bonappetit.com/blogsandforums/blogs/badaily/2011/04/how-to-poach-eggs-in-the-microwave.html

For anyone eating HFLC, this is a lifesaver:

http://www.bonappetit.com/blogsandforums/blogs/badaily/2011/04/how-to-poach-eggs-in-the-microwave.html

^^^
quality... thank you!

Hey guys,

Not to change the subject too much, but I was wondering if anybody has read 'The China Study' but T. Colin Cambell? Just got it from somebody for christmas and was looking forward to reading it soon....

looks like an obsession with leafy and low fat stuff with very little real, satiating foods. is this an ideal day for you for what you actually eat? i think i'd be angry going to bed on a diet like this...

this is the LCHF thread, you might want to check out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSeSTq-N4U4

not to be too critical since i think your diet is better than most, but we have some very different ideas of what "healthy" eating is.



i'm sorry to hear that. you must work out from dawn to dusk.

leafy = generally great! Vegetables RULE!!! Why would you think this is not "healthy" eating? Too much of what? Too little of what?

So one of my good friends who is getting his Master's in Nutrition right now said I should read these books: Primal Blueprint, Eat Move and be Healthy, and Perfect Health Diet (his favorite).

Have you guys read these books?

Not to change the subject too much, but I was wondering if anybody has read 'The China Study' but T. Colin Cambell? Just got it from somebody for christmas and was looking forward to reading it soon....

I used to think it was an awesome example of the dangers of consuming animal products but then I saw Tim Ferriss dismantle it pretty well at the end of the 4 Hour Body (I think the main point was it was bad science/inferences). I'm not informed enough on either side of the argument to make comment but I think both sides are worth checking out (something not enough people do in general).

the China Study was an observational study. it was a good start, but its hypotheses are not panning out in clinical trials.

http://www.dietdoctor.com/weight-loss-time-to-stop-denying-the-science

the difference between observation studies and clinical trials:
http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/statistics/observational-studies-2
Science for Smart People (Youtube)

leafy = generally great! Vegetables RULE!!! Why would you think this is not "healthy" eating? Too much of what? Too little of what?

if you like veggies, go for it. but i just think you could add more fat. other than the eggs, almonds, chocolate, peanuts, i see very little fat in that diet. so it seems like most of your energy is coming from carbs (and the associated short-term metabolic responses to such a diet as people keep repeating in the thread like the constant hunger and mental fogginess), even if they are unrefined. but i could be wrong and maybe you eat the chicken breasts with the skin intact.

i tried to read The Primal Blueprint when i first started paleo, but there's too much rambling and pseudoscientific claims imo. thus the reason why i chose to start a new thread. i've not read the other two books you mentioned.

IDK what happened but all the sudden I see the China study everywhere. One of my vegan buddies is going crazy over this documentary that quotes this study as basically the end all be all holy grail of absolute proof that meat = swift death.

The study suffers from the typical food studies in that correlation does not mean causation. They compare different groups with a million different variables, one of which is meat consumption, then conclude that the meat is the sole cause of all that ails those who are eating it.

I heard an interview with one of these celebacy advocates awhile back and she tried to argue that because Japanese women don't take birth control as much, that is why they get less breast cancer. This is essentially what the China study does. There are a million reasons they get less breast cancer, they weigh less and eat a completely different diet for starters, yet people point to one thing and say "that must be it".