Heads Up NL Poker Forums

OK so I try to play a positional game and open a wide range IP. Some players seem to exploit this by 3-betting with about a ~35% frequency. I have been playing tiny stakes at AP and run into players who do not fold NEARLY enough - therefore I play a very value-based game with a neg. red line. But how do I handle the light 3bet?

4-bet bluffing light seems wrong as these players also tend to call WAY too much.

Tightening up seems right but if I play a PR of 8 I get blinded out.

Flatting seems like the best option with big cards but everything I know about poker says don't flat a 3bet, even IP, and fold to the cbet post flop on a whiff. Then again calling that cbet with KQ overcards seems wrong too.

Shoving seems wrong as it will only get called by worse.

Even 4-betting for value seems wrong because when I miss a flop and cbet they dont fold.


I have come to the conclusion that I should be flatting a lot of Ax-type hands (that win at showdown a lot) and just let him bluff his way to pot commitment when I hit. Also I can call with 88-TT and close my eyes and call down IP - even 3 streets. I still end up folding post a lot and wonder if I'm making a profitable play.

I can also just min raise but then I miss value for my strong hands - lay odds for him to crack my strong hands - and still end up losing a ton of money folding to 3bets too much.


Any suggestions? TY

4bet wider for value with the intention of snapping off way more hands than you're used to should he 5bet jam.

Minraise button or open less is good.

Also, you're not gonna miss EVERY flop. Be prepared to play back with equity. In a 4bet pot if someones flatting a ton then the obviously adjustments I'd make are;

a) don't 4bet light ever

b) be prepared to stack off w/ any good Ax on a decent amount of boards (c/c is better to trap air).

c) if you're really having trouble (running bad against a maniac HU can be gnarly) - find a more passive opponent and make some money.

EDIT: Your comment about flatting 88-TT to a guy 3betting >30% shows you're still adjusting from ring games (I presume thats what you're experiance lies in?) - these hands should absolutely be apart of your 4bet/calling range and I'm stacking off on a lot of flops should villain flat you.

EDIT II: Flatting IP with big cards is a fine adjustment; don't consider it bad at all - who taught you to think like that? If a dude is 3betting me 30% then stuff like a KJ/KQ, even QJ etc are all super strong and I'm playing for stacks if I flop a piece.

I think a big part of your mentality at the moment is you're not used to how much wider ranges are at HU. 30% 3betters are certainly not super standard, but I'd say you need to be prepared to start shipping stacks a lot lighter than you're used to.

Hope I helped a bit!

Who says dont call 3bets??

In HU its way more common to call 3bets, especially vs these maniac guys.

Just adjust to how they are playing.
If they are 3betting a ton, limp the BTN or minraise.

See what hands they are 3betting with and what hands they are cbetting after they 3betting.

If the cold call what range are they cold calling with and see how they play that postflop. This way you can eliminate hands from his cold 3bettting range.

Also I dont always think 4betting TT-88 should be in your 4bet/call range. Against some opponents its good to use as a bloated up bluff catcher in 3bet pots. obv depends on his shoving range and how he plays 3bet pots etc though.

My adjustments I make (in order). I rarely get to #4 and most the time I combine the top 3
1. 4b a lighter value range*
2. Call more of his 3bs
3. Tighten up my opening range**
4. Minraise button or limp***


* I would 4b shove hands like 22-88. Also Id make a normal 4b then call a 5b jam w/ hands like AJs+ 99+ AQo+. The first part is assuming I expect him to fold 70+% of the time and with a 35% 3b I would figure that is the case. If I dont expect him to fold to a 4b jam often then Im pretty much 4b jamming all these hands other than AA and KK (and 22-44 im folding those) but Im going to be ready to ride the variance train.

I dont have stove on this computer. But if he is 3b like 35% and calling 40% of my 4b jams then he is calling a 4b jam w/ 14% of his range. Im pretty sure 55-QQ, AJs+, and AQo+ is doing decent against the top 14% of someones range. (Anyone want to stove it for me?)

** I dont tighten up much. Maybe drop the really bad part of my opeing range off. But I usually start off opening 100% so I might go down to something like 75-80%.

*** If you read the other thread about what to do against a light 3ber you know I hate minraising/limping the button. I rarely do this because its like giving anyone who isn't brain dead instant knowledge that you are thinking enough to adjust to their play. Id rather have my opponents take as long as possible before they realize I've adjusted.

It sort of depends on your aversion to variance and how well you think you will play in bloated pots relative to the specific player. I play lower levels, where the ones that are maniacal pre also are ridiculously spewy post, so I don't even try to "outplay" them. I 4bet wider with lots of pairs and AJ+ and willingly ship if needed. But the better adjustment for me is to simply mix it up and limp quite a few hands. It tends to frustrate them, since they just want to 3-bet a lot. If they start auto-raising your limps, then throw in some value limp-raises to the mix. If they are only 3xing your limp, then limp-call a lot of mid-strength hands and play position. Min-raising is another good option, one I used to do more, but have gotten away from in exchange for limping.

My point is you can fight aggression with aggression if you don't mind variance and are confident in your post game in 3-bet pots. If you are not, then I would simply be more aggro with all pairs and large A,K hands and play small ball with the rest of your range.

Most importantly I think is simply how you view the opponent. If he is bad spewy, wait and he will make the mistakes for you. If he is good aggro, then you will likely have to fight fire with fire, b/c he will realize you are trying to trap.

Thanks for all of the great replies.

I normally play 100 and 200 NL - and show a decent win over a large sample. So I suppose I'm better post flop than the average micro AP HU player. The variance is not an issue to my BR as well at these levels.

As most of you know at small and mid levels you can get a lot of folds by 4-betting, or check raising some flop where you have equity and all is well, but to simply flat and play fit or fold is probably -EV. This is where I get "don't flat and play fit or fold" from.

Flatting these player would have to be fit or fold. They will not fold to check raises with a 33 undie or a gutty etc. I'm pretty sure that since I have skill and position, I can get them to spew their stacks away very often when I do hit. So I suppose the most exploitable line would be to flat and play almost fit or fold and going for the value throat - since "always betting and never folding" is lol exploitable.

I just wanted to make sure, I suppose, that I won't burn too much money by flatting the 3bet and folding to a lot of post flop cbets. Many of these players have flop turn river freqs of like 100/100/80. They might slow down oop if I call the flop once and bet a turn when checked to, but they tire of that quickly, lol.

Making adjustments should be based on how you interpret what he is going to do.

Id say the biggest/best adjustment to people 3betting lots is to tighten up. Why?

Because this way him 3betting becomes a bigger mistakes and it forces him to play a tighter game OOP, and pushes him to 3bet smaller (to get better value on his 3bet steals) if he is bluff 3betting a lot.

This way we can start more profitably calling IP and playing postflop poker.

I tihnk 4betting for value lighter is fine but there are a lot of bad players postflop, and there is so much value to be had if we call 3bets and make him make bigger mistakes where his equity share is smaller.

Against good players who can make improper jams more often than spew postflop then 4betting is better (as Krantz describes when he plays durra2000 or whatever she is called).

I think min raising should also be a function of how often someome cold calls. The more they cold call the more I prefer 3x it.

NWF
You will be proud of me.

I found a spot tonight where I thought the best adjustment was to minraise.

The guy was 3b 25% of the time to 10bb and had a 60-70bb stack the entire time. I couldnt profitably call light and he was spazy so he was shoving over my 4bs.

And when I min raised he continued to 3b to 10bb. All it did was save me 1bb per hand. But hell that is 50ptbb/100 over 100 hands that I would r/f to a 3b.