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Tuneman07

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381 posts
Joined 06/2011

Hey just wanted to chime in here- you don't have to get hit by a meteor to get crushed with bills. The cost of anything relating to health care in the U.S. is outrageous.

I cut my hand on the palm side of my fingers a month ago- bad/nasty looking but I've had worse for sure. I went to the doc- 400 for a visit, antibiotics and a bandage. A week later the cuts are fine but my fingers won't move- I go to a hand specialist he has me in surgery the next day for lacerated tendons, 16 weeks of physical therapy in front of me now and the total for this is going to end at around 35-50K USD.

It was a small cut but we really are fragile and I swear they bill by the second lol. This is all covered by insurance tho otherwise 50K is going to busto just about anyone. The care has been incredible though- top surgeon at a great facility and a team of therapists and expensive looking equipment.

I am incredibly thankful for the medical care we have in this country- unfortunately its difficult to make the math work- maybe even impossible for every person to get this kind of care. I don't pretend to know what you really can do about that.

Posted 11 months ago

nawhead

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2484 posts
Joined 10/2009

This is even more nonsensical than before.


ummm... i disagree?? Poke Tongue

sorry for not replying sooner, but my computer crashed this morning and i just got finished putting everything back together.

i will reply to your post in full, but in the interim, i'll just leave this here.

Posted 11 months ago

medic2038

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299 posts
Joined 07/2009

This is even more nonsensical than before. People don't need incentive to not be poor. Poor people may be free to pursue a better life, but not only is the deck stacked against them, there are several stacked decks stacked on top of each other for them. I've been working with kids for a nonprofit in the inner city for merely a year, and I shudder to think about what their lives are likely to be through no fault of their own.



While this is a bit off topic, I agree here. I use to believe in the whole "well if you're poor go get an education or skill" thing. However being a recent grad and finding it's impossible to get a job, my perception has changed a bit.

Granted I still have my paramedic that I can fall back on whenever, but I graduated cum laude and can't even get an interview (and that's with my resume being good AND having supervisory experience in EMS)!

The economy is so F-ed up, most of the "entry level" business positions I'm looking for require 3-5 years experience.

Posted 11 months ago

Steppin Razor

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Section 9
2237 posts
Joined 12/2009

While this is a bit off topic, I agree here. I use to believe in the whole "well if you're poor go get an education or skill" thing. However being a recent grad and finding it's impossible to get a job, my perception has changed a bit.


Being a recent grad, your whole future has been adjusted down. If you are lucky enough to find a job, you won't be paid the same as someone who got the same job in an economic boom. So your whole working life, you will get an X% increase from whatever your current at the time wages are, based on a lower salary to begin with. Through no fault of your own, through no reflection of ability. You really should be inventing something IMO.

It's pretty bad for you, but you were still able to go to college. Like I said, I've only been working for a year. I teach mostly middle school kids how to build chopper style bicycles. Most of my students, 12-15yrs old, don't know fractions. Some don't know multiplication. One school we get kids from didn't have science or english teachers for several months. Didn't have books. Some have parents in jail, some who didn't graduate high school, so no educational support at home. We hold events sometimes where the kids show off what they've done at the shop, and no parents come. We have some high school kids as well. None of them have learned to drive, a rite of passage for middle and upper income teens. If you have no access to a car or can pay for driving school, you can't learn to do it.
One high school senior we have was lucky enough to get into a magnet school. Got a college prep education. Volunteered every year for at least 3 different programs each year since he was in 8th grade. Applied to the Naval Academy and got his letter from Congress, but didn't get into the Academy. He did however get into 4 other schools, none of which he can afford to get into even with scholarships. He's spending this summer volunteering and trying to find work welding to earn some money.
He's an exception though. Most of the kids in the neighborhood I work in are unlikely to make it past high school because there is no support around them for anything. And kids need that, no matter what circumstance they're in. They need to have people believe in them, to spend time showing them they have value, to push them to try. If no one ever pushed a kid to try, rich or poor, they aren't going to develop the life skills they'll need to even put a foot on a path to success. If you don't tell a 10yr old or 11yr old that they can do something, praise them when they do, get them to try again when they fail, they aren't going to be able to do jack shit when they get older.
And I've got great kids. The top section of the neighborhood kids. They get some of that stuff above from our program, and they work hard when they get there. But the kids who don't come to the program are extremely unlikely to make more than poverty wages unless they sell drugs.

Anyway, a derail but the absurdity of, 'don't be poor' is headshaking.

Posted 11 months ago

nawhead

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2484 posts
Joined 10/2009

sorry, still being lazy with replies. just came into the thread to hit and run a youtube link.

Obamacare on Stossel

(wow, i guess i'm a FOX news watcher now (FOX Business at least, but FOX nonetheless). too funny since i was the pot-smoking-bleeding-heart-Michael-Moore-lovin-liberal for so long. so this is what growing up feels like? hmm... interesting.)

Posted 11 months ago

nawhead

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2484 posts
Joined 10/2009

While this is a bit off topic, I agree here. I use to believe in the whole "well if you're poor go get an education or skill" thing. However being a recent grad and finding it's impossible to get a job, my perception has changed a bit.

Granted I still have my paramedic that I can fall back on whenever, but I graduated cum laude and can't even get an interview (and that's with my resume being good AND having supervisory experience in EMS)!

The economy is so F-ed up, most of the "entry level" business positions I'm looking for require 3-5 years experience.


it's a semi-derail, but i think it's within the spirit of this conversation.

the economy is in the tanks and getting a foot in the door is hard these days, but nobody said otherwise. we have to make a distinction here between pursuing wealth (which is always hard) versus being guaranteed safety by the government so we don't have to do anything at all.

what you seem to be hinting at is that since it's hard to get jobs right now, it's now government's role to guarantee you the benefits that only a good job used to give people.

but what are the unintended consequences of such policies? where does government get its money to give you those benefits for free? it doesn't come from thin air (well sometimes it does, but that's a further derail), individuals and businesses pay for it. so in this case with Obamacare, we now tax the rich (who usually run businesses) even more. you think those people are just going to eat the loss? no, the businesses they run are going to change their policies to reflect the added cost of doing business, policies like not hiring new workers. it's a vicious circle.

i hoped that made sense. Milton Friedman says it a lot better than i can.

Posted 11 months ago

medic2038

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299 posts
Joined 07/2009


what you seem to be hinting at is that since it's hard to get jobs right now, it's now government's role to guarantee you the benefits that only a good job used to give people.



Actually quite the opposite! I'm a very strict constitutionalist, thus I believe the government's job is rather limited.

I was just saying that the standard talk radio assumption (that I used to agree with) that if you're poor, it's your fault. That's certainly not true at all. I worked my ass of in college (while working full time)to get my grades, but I can't even get an employer to give me a call back. But then again I'm still trying to take steps (like starting grad school next month) to make my life better, for the time being I'm still using my vocation rather then my education.

Posted 11 months ago

Steppin Razor

Avatar for Steppin Razor

Section 9
2237 posts
Joined 12/2009

sorry, still being lazy with replies. just came into the thread to hit and run a youtube link.

Obamacare on Stossel

(wow, i guess i'm a FOX news watcher now (FOX Business at least, but FOX nonetheless). too funny since i was the pot-smoking-bleeding-heart-Michael-Moore-lovin-liberal for so long. so this is what growing up feels like? hmm... interesting.)


I don't care about FOX, but Stossel proved he was a moron when he was on 20/20.




what you seem to be hinting at is that since it's hard to get jobs right now, it's now government's role to guarantee you the benefits that only a good job used to give people.


No, what he is saying is that you aren't a billionaire not because you don't want to be. It's because no matter how hard you work, you are very unlikely to ever become one.

Posted 11 months ago

StueysKid

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969 posts
Joined 11/2009

Stossel proved he was a moron on 20/20? Okay. Everyone has their opinions, especially political ones.

He's one of maybe two media persons that I've seen discuss the poker issue. Obviously that's only one issue, but I can't remember disagreeing with him about a whole lot.

Anyway, I happened to come across this article this morning on Forbes:
Obamacare's Dark Secret

Posted 11 months ago

Steppin Razor

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Section 9
2237 posts
Joined 12/2009

Stossel proved he was a moron on 20/20? Okay. Everyone has their opinions, especially political ones.

He's one of maybe two media persons that I've seen discuss the poker issue. Obviously that's only one issue, but I can't remember disagreeing with him about a whole lot.


Anyway, I happened to come across this article this morning on Forbes:
Obamacare's Dark Secret


I'll get to the article another day, but how is realizing Stossel is an idiot a political opinion?

Posted 11 months ago

improva

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3767 posts
Joined 02/2008

It is beyond my understanding why people have to buy health insurance at all. It would be cheaper for everybody if health care was 100% tax founded.

Posted 11 months ago

Steppin Razor

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Section 9
2237 posts
Joined 12/2009

It is beyond my understanding why people have to buy health insurance at all. It would be cheaper for everybody if health care was 100% tax founded.


This is America. The amount of money we spend is way less important than who gets it. It pisses us off if no one is profiting off of us.


Interesting article re: what medic was talking about.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/the-jobless-class-of-2012.html

"College graduates who obtained their first job between 2009 and 2011 earned $27,000 a year or 10% less than those who entered the workforce in the two previous years"

"Only a half of those who graduated since 2006 are now employed full time, according to a recent Rutgers University survey. More college graduates are settling for jobs that in years past would have gone to those without degrees, while people in their 30s are now occupying jobs once taken by recent graduates"

Posted 11 months ago

rrumsey

Avatar for rrumsey

5422 posts
Joined 06/2010

please dont game insurance companies with this bc if a lot of people do it will fuck our system. its so dumb that the fine is so small. it should have been set up as an easy fistpump buy insurance bc the fine is big lol. defeats the whole idea some if it is game-able

Posted 11 months ago

nawhead

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2484 posts
Joined 10/2009

I don't care about FOX, but Stossel proved he was a moron when he was on 20/20.


it would be tragic if a person never changed or learned from his mistakes. the only thing i knew about Stossel before was him getting punched in the face on TV a while back. i didn't think too much about him, and he was just another TV guy to me. but nowadays, he seems to present himself very humbly and self-aware (Stossel interviewed on Uncommon Knowledge).

but ymmv. he might still be a moron if you don't agree with his politics.

Posted 11 months ago

rrumsey

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5422 posts
Joined 06/2010

It is beyond my understanding why people have to buy health insurance at all. It would be cheaper for everybody if health care was 100% tax founded.


in theory if people would act in such a way to help reduce costs (AKA everyone works out, doesn't smoke, is proactive about seeing doctors early) then you are correct. But this is america, we are more focused on eating junk food, smoking a few packs a day, and watching reruns of american idol on our asses lol. people are so under motivated in this country ( that means a lot when a lazy 23 year old thinks so many people are lazy as shit)

Posted 11 months ago




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