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+1 to having a low cb %. And when you do cb, you should do so with hands that you can barrel if need be. They call too much so that is exploited by betting a wide range for value, not by bluffing generally.

I play 100nl online but I've put in a ton of volume at live 200nl in Vegas where I live. Basically just bet for value, that's all there is to it.

The leaks you see out of the other players are obvious. Some are nits, some are stations, etc.

There's not too many tough spots, and if you run into a tough spot it's usually a cooler. Chances are if you win online and you're losing live you just haven't put in enough volume.

+1 to having a low cb %. And when you do cb, you should do so with hands that you can barrel if need be. They call too much so that is exploited by betting a wide range for value, not by bluffing generally.

my cbet % goes way up live. Mostly due to the fact that people don't attack cbets very often.

My cbet % goes way up too and I think it should. People are generally calling opens with all kinds of weird hands to "try and hit a flop". Most of the time they don't and a cbet will take it down. I also generally vary my cbet size depending on my hand strength and the tendencies of the people who still have cards. Is this unbalanced? Absolutely! Does anyone pay attention? Nope

I guess I should clarify that my cb % is still pretty high if it's 2 or 3 handed. However, as often is the case, 4+ people see the flop a fair amount of the time. I think cbetting into this many people is not smart.

One problem I have with cbetting is that even when you barrel the card that "should" remove all bluffs from your range (like xxxA +FD hitting while flop was 4way), I thus give up on the river since they must have something only to show 72 for bottom pair or something. Maybe 3barreling is very good as people peel too much but get afraid once the bets become huge, though everyone also slowplays all the time...

Regarding limping, I think given the right table conditions having a limping range from early is really good. Look left a lot, that tends to help. Consequentially if you actually have a limping range you can LRR too, those spots can be fairly profitable depending on table conditions.

Depending on stack depth my cbet % is fairly high live. That said it's fairly high online too so maybe I'm just a bit of an outlier. The mass multiway pots need to be treated with caution, sometimes I'll cbet a 5 outer with no showdownable value if I think that everyone will fold or make a multiway steal if I think everyone will fold. But yeah for the most part the mass multiway pots are just about playing your equity better than your opponents.

One problem I have with cbetting is that even when you barrel the card that "should" remove all bluffs from your range (like xxxA +FD hitting while flop was 4way), I thus give up on the river since they must have something only to show 72 for bottom pair or something. Maybe 3barreling is very good as people peel too much but get afraid once the bets become huge, though everyone also slowplays all the time...

Live tells are pure gold here. Don't be afraid to 3 barrel if people are calling the first 2 really light if you sense that they are weak for whatever reason. Perceived range just works different vs the live fish. Live players have an idea of your perceived range that's most likely very different to online players. So that card might not actually remove all the bluffs in your range in their mind, or possibly they aren't thinking about what you are representing at all in the first place.

One problem I have with cbetting is that even when you barrel the card that "should" remove all bluffs from your range (like xxxA +FD hitting while flop was 4way), I thus give up on the river since they must have something only to show 72 for bottom pair or something. Maybe 3barreling is very good as people peel too much but get afraid once the bets become huge, though everyone also slowplays all the time...

People have to see all 5 cards on the board most of the time, going for 3 would be ok but just giving up on the flop reduces variance.

One problem I have with cbetting is that even when you barrel the card that "should" remove all bluffs from your range (like xxxA +FD hitting while flop was 4way), I thus give up on the river since they must have something only to show 72 for bottom pair or something. Maybe 3barreling is very good as people peel too much but get afraid once the bets become huge, though everyone also slowplays all the time...

I can relate to this, it's just so random sometimes. What I mean by that is sometimes I'll be valuebetting the turn and I bet large, and the guy lays it down and shows that he folded TP. This has happened to me quite often. So then the next session I start bluffing the turn with big bets only to give up on the river thinking villain must be nutted, and he shows down second pair or something. I guess it just comes down to getting reads on who has MUBS or is scared money or w/e and who is cally.

Regarding limping, I think given the right table conditions having a limping range from early is really good. Look left a lot, that tends to help. Consequentially if you actually have a limping range you can LRR too, those spots can be fairly profitable depending on table conditions.
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So what you're saying here is that if you look left and see someone grabbing chips to raise, you'll limp with QQ+ intending to LRR?

If you have a really solid read that a player will raise behind you then the lrr pay can be great as it can take down a ton of dead money.

All bad poker players live or online will eventually succumb to the bad decisions they make at the table. Online, the bad players will bust more quickly because they are involved in more hands/pots per hour where as in live poker you are only getting about 35 hands per hour. So it may take longer for for your skill advantage to come through playing live. Sometimes 4 or 5 hours before the fish will bust sometimes longer, and add in a little bit of run bad even longer, but they will bust. The loose multi way pots type of table is the most profitable if you are a TAG. Some times when playing a TAG style not enough emphasis is put on the T& A tight aggressive aspect. You are hammering the bad players when you are folding, and trying to destroy them when you are betting and raising. Just another one of my crazy thoughts on this. Good luck.

the reason bad players go bust quicker online is because their opponents are better. Most of live poker is just fish shuffling money among each other.

Personally I'd say I play pretty much any PP live. A ton of your money is going to come from flopping sets. Limping was definitely one of those things you should adjust to, and put in your range.

Like some other people said you want to be limping your SC, small PPs, and probably gappers especially if the pot is multiway. I also tend to overlimp suited aces and kings sometimes as well.

I'll complete in the SB if there's a few limpers and I have a decent hand. I'd say be very careful about the small/mid SCs though, there's a TON of flush over flush live.

For raising I found that most tables have somewhat of a "sweet spot". My standard open is 5bb+1limper. Even then if you get 1 caller, then you're gonna get 2, and it cascades into a massive pot that's 5-6 ways.

I'd say one of the spots where I tend to lose money is when I raise, but I'm not able to cbet.

I think there's certain spots where you CAN 3bet light, but I would say don't do it to try to induce a fold. In my games there's people that open way too wide, and you can definitely 3bet them for value. But it's almost a 100% certainty that if they raise, they're calling a 3bet.

AGTJ it sucks that your coolers are running so close together. That happens, and it's especially brutal live. I get nights where I'm card dead or can't hit a board, and end up walking away with like 7bb for 6 hours.

I play very similarly to you medic.

the reason bad players go bust quicker online is because their opponents are better. Most of live poker is just fish shuffling money among each other.

This is almost certainly the reason fish lose slower live. On occasion I've played in some really tough live games and the fish just get annihilated there.

It would be different if some of the best live players in the room were allowed to play on all of the tables.

Exactly Tecmo.

It would be different if some of the best live players in the room were allowed to play on all of the tables.

I was thinking of playing two tables at Bellagio. The tables are definitely close enough together to have one chair between two spots :-)

I was thinking of playing two tables at Bellagio. The tables are definitely close enough together to have one chair between two spots :-)

That would be pretty sweet if they allowed that.

It seems like every time I have a good hand worth a few value bets, I get raised, usually by players I've never played with before and thus don't have a good read on and have to fold. Tonight I open AQ UTG, cbet an AJ4s board 3 way, get a caller, and guy in position makes it $75.

I open AT in the CO and 50bb stack in the BB calls. Flop comes AQJ, I cbet, and he shoves all in. I fold (this was probably close).

I open AKs UTG like 3 hands later, and same player who now has like 40BB 3bets like half his stack. I pretty much have to shove (right?) and my AK loses.

I open QJ in HJ and 2 players call. I cbet a J65s board, get raised by BB and have to fold.

Maybe I just remember them more, but hands like these seem to happen A LOT. Like they either fold, or raise flop and I fold. Or call flop raise turn and I fold. I honestly don't think I've been in a situation in the last 2.5 weeks where I've hand a good had and went bet bet bet and got called down and was good. Either they fold, raise, or call me down with better.

It's getting to the point where I don't even know if I should be folding in these spots - like I question whether or not the game dynamics are just a lot more aggressive and players are raising with bluffs or weak TP or middle pair "to see where they're at." I always look for these reads, but I play with so many different players that I've never seen before and thus don't have reads on, so it's hard to tell.

Whether or not you call the shove on the AT hand probably depends on how big you're opening and how much you're c-betting. You could definitely be getting odds since he can have stuff like KQ and JT in his range just as easily as he can have 2p+.

In general though, I don't think you can go wrong using bet/fold as your default line in spots like the ones you've mentioned. I doubt you're getting run over at 1/2 even if it feels like it. Even if they are "bluffing" you off, it's not because they're making moves but because they're overplaying their hands and don't realize a raise UTG pre and c-bet on an ace high board screams strength. Just pay attention to figure out who's putting in small raises "to see where they're at," who is only doing it with monsters, and who, if anyone, is capable of doing it as a bluff. And if your game is this aggro, seat change and table change if you can. Otherwise, tighten up pre, loosen up post, and embrace the variance.

Regarding limping, I think given the right table conditions having a limping range from early is really good. Look left a lot, that tends to help. Consequentially if you actually have a limping range you can LRR too, those spots can be fairly profitable depending on table conditions.

have tried this out a couple times when there are limpers in front of me and aggro raisers behind me. it's worked out really well. there's just tons of dead money when they all call and the raiser has a wide range.

* Bluffing in spots with little fold equity (i.e. trying to get live players to make a big laydown because you took a very strong line).
* Not value betting thin enough against the postflop stations.
* Three-betting and calling too much versus preflop raises (live raising ranges are tighter, they don't fold to 3bets, and their raise sizes are so big that they cut down your implied odds substantially).
* Letting boredom / ego drive them to play too many hands or try to exhibit too much fancy-play syndrome.

AGTJ--

You aren't really asking a specific question, so you are getting answers from all over the board. Lots of good advice for sure. I am also trying to make the switch from online to live, and at the same time, trying to get from LHE to NLHE.

Nina W has lots of experience online as well as live, and I really like the points he makes (others also, no disrespect to y'all)

I would add something from a beginner's perspective, and perhaps I am wrong, so all y'all can correct me (please do, if needed)

I think online and live are very different games. There seems to be a 'group think' at work online that makes certain lines work, and certain 'theories' of poker get re-inforced as being correct. So we wind up getting light 3 bets being countered by light 4 bets. Steals are so common, and 3 bets OOP by blinds in response so many, that the average raise size has moved to at or close to min raises. This stuff works online, but only because most of the players are playing alike.

Live the game seems to be progressing slower. The 'group think' that lends itself to a certain homogenous quality of play is missing (if you don't count Loose / passive) and the game actually may be changing at higher limits far faster than that at low limits. It seems the better players are disregarding the 1/2 NLHE games if at all possible, so I assume (I may be wrong here) that the quality of play is actually steeper at high limits and changing faster than the bottom levels. I think the highest games being harder and harder for fish to win at, and thus it is harder to find a game at higher limits may back up my theory here (or it could be the economy, or both)

The best source I have found for trying to navigate the online/live transition has been Bart Hanson. He has a premium podcast that is free for DC members who subscribe more than monthly, and he has had several podcasts featuring live players who made the transition from online. Shane Rose 10/5/2010 was a good episode for this where Shane told of losing about $50K at live games before making the correct adjustments. Bart mentions, and I completely agree that beating bad players is different than beating good players. I think perhaps there being more bad players live may also make the game different enough that online guys might struggle. (when you ISO raise and you still get 4 callers, the game plays differently)

bet/fold is the best weapon of all at low levels if Bart is to be believed.

Raises pre may bloat the pot enough, and make SPR's low enough that we are actually negating some of our advantage post flop. If we riase, but no one folds, a capped game can not leave much room for play post flop. (maybe a smaller raise pre would be in order?)

position and reads become more important relative to 'lines of play' that are online staples. There is soooo much info available live, take advantage of this. Pay attention to everything.

just a few thoughts, good luck with the transition, your posts always seem well thought out, I cannot believe you will not get back on track.

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