BigBadBabar
4432 posts
Joined 03/2007
I guess I am a huge nit but I routinely fold KTo, KTs, KJo, KJs, and KQo here. Not only are you often dominated but you have to worry about the players to act behind you and/or the original raiser capping. It just seems like a perfect spot to fold and protect your peanuts
Fwiw, if a guy who has opened every hand for 3 hours opens in early position I'm definitely folding KTo in middle position and waiting for a better spot. It's just not a hand I want to put a lot of money in with and I will have ample opportunity to win bets from him since I have position on him and he's opening 100% of his hands 
i don't disagree with you that it can be uncomfortable and sort of counterintuitive to start 3betting lots of okay-but-not-great hands in this kind of dynamic. but if he is truly raising any two cards then KTo is a 60/40 favorite pf and that's a pretty darn big edge in lhe these days. you are right that sometimes someone behind will take 3 to the face, or coldcap, or whatever, or the original guy will cap (that doesn't really change his range all that much imo though; he's pretty likely to cap 87s for example).
those are sort of pessimistic thoughts though. think of the optimistic ones: we are profiting pf with our stronger range. we play as well or better than this guy postflop. we have position on him! we drive the blinds' dead money out giving us a bigger pot to fight for. we take the initiative so most of the times when no one hits a hand we win the pot. etc etc.
i think avoiding gross or thin or aggressive situations is fine, and can help you become a solid tight-tag sort of fr player, and can help you beat the lowish stakes no problem (whether that is live or online). but as you start to try to beat the medium stakes or more aggressive games or what have you that you're going to have to get more comfortable in thin or aggressive spots, etc. if this guy hypothetically is opening any two cards then we should be 3betting the %$#* out of him (within reason) and seizing these peanuts for ourselves! nom.
Posted over 3 years ago
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BigBadBabar
4432 posts
Joined 03/2007
now, granted, he's not opening any two, so let's move back from our hypothetical. but he was laggy and opening a fair bit, and all the other things apply. when in doubt while making a video i like to take the aggressive line both to explore it and for the potential benefit/hilarity of those watching. so, there you have it! 
Posted over 3 years ago
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BigBadBabar
4432 posts
Joined 03/2007
You say that the average player doesnt ch/call here with a lot of stuff, but from my experience they seem to hate folding flops but love folding turns.
Whether that leans me more towards a valuebet/merging bet on the turn or a check back and considering making a pretty big KQ call down, im not sure... but a pretty average fold to cbet in my games is like 30%
edit: you address this thought process...
i agree with you that i have no idea what the right move is
yeah, neat lil hu spot. small pots ftw!
Posted over 3 years ago
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BigBadBabar
4432 posts
Joined 03/2007
utg+1 you open the QTs
but the very next hand you fold ATo utg.
comments?
I think ATo is usually an open for me... is it an obvious open if its ATs?
utg and utg+1 are pretty similar positions at a full table seeing as we can expect utg (when we are utg+1) to be super tight and we are looking to get through almost the same field in both hands.
I feel like AT plays at least as well if not better than QT does against cold callers... seeing as we are dominately less often with AT vs a cc
against a 3better i feel just as gross with both hands.
I dunno though =)
i really go back and forth - don't have super set ranges. often can depend i suppose on small factors like whether i've raised recently or not, or if i get distracted making a video
i'd say ats is an open most always for me utg. ato not necessarily always. qts not necessarily always. 9handed ftp tables are nicer than 10handed stars tables imo.
Posted over 3 years ago
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PygmyHero
4246 posts
Joined 08/2007
I'm going to skip time stamps as everything I took a note on is already linked ITT.
Nice upside down nub.
It might be the hardware acceleration - I have fewer problems when it's off.
~4 KTo - I think this is a fold rather than a 3b. I would fold KTs and KJo as well. I just think the normal FR tightness outweighs the factors you mention.
~25 AQo - I like the PF non-cap and agree with l_q that we should strongly consider folding the river.
~36 KQs - I think this is very well played and think you should probably call the river UI if it bricks. l_q - I don't think it'd quite be a hero call as our hand is ~ A high.
~54 l_q mentioned you opened QTs UTG+1 and then folded ATo on the next hand UTG. I agree with him - that seems somewhat paradoxic. I don't hate either play (raise/fold) for either but think it should probably be the same for both, depending on our style. I'd probably tend to fold both as a default.
Also I swear I saw you open A-rag suited UTG or UTG+1. I don't think it'd be a soul crushing error (especially as these are 9 max tables), but I do think it'd be too loose. But I can't find the time stamp now so maybe I'm making it up.
Posted over 3 years ago
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iseedeadmoney
138 posts
Joined 05/2010
iseedeadmoney
138 posts
Joined 05/2010
Time Link to 00:49:25
This is a spot where I always like to have at least one guy who will bet the hand for us on the flop and it helps to look at the aggression factors of the players who limped(particularly the button). If our hand was say Kx on a K53 flop then I would checkraise all day because there aren't many overcards or hands that we need to worry about checking through. If someone has a pair they're gonna bet it.
Here we have to worry about too many hands that get to see a free turn. I'd rather bet out and get some value and make a decision on the turn action. Take note of this hand and don't bet out hands like T9/T7 because you'll be getting a free shot to make your hand against this dynamic.
Posted almost 3 years ago
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BigBadBabar
4432 posts
Joined 03/2007
I call down here unless I'm absolutely sure he can't possibly be trying something silly. Fishy players do fishy things in BBvsb confrontations.
Yuck, just looked at it now and I don't like that I made this fold at all. Also, I said the board wasn't very drawy when in fact it is at least somewhat so.
Posted almost 3 years ago
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Alexashka
265 posts
Joined 07/2009
Folding KQo vs mid position raise, really? That hand is suuuuuper easy to play. I'd 3bet JTs and feel very confident about it.
At 3/6 you should be outplaying almost everyone, so 3-bet lighter, call in SB/BB looser.
Posted almost 3 years ago
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