Mid/High Stakes Limit Hold'em Poker Forums

Villain in this case is a grinder/reg on Pokerstars. Stats: 29/21/1.5, with a 3 bet preflop percentage of 10%. Since I was doing a cut off steal here, I give him a wider range than 10%, but that gives you an idea.

The turn comes and I check/raise my open ended straight draw. I did not do it on the flop because I just thought that it would look too much like a semibluff. My plan is to represent the ace and hopefully fold out better K-hi and Q-hi hands. Maybe smaller pocket pairs, though in retrospect, 99+ probably isn't folding 66-88 made a set already and I'm not sure if this particular guy would 3! bet me with 55 or 44. 22 and 33 are almost out of the question.

Anyways, I'd like to hear comments on this. I was hoping for an immediate fold and planned to check/fold the river if I didn't improve. Thanks.

Poker Stars $5/$10 Limit Hold'em - 6 players - View hand 351974
The Official DeucesCracked.com Hand History Converter

Pre Flop: (1.4 SB) Hero is CO with 9 Q
2 folds, Hero raises, BTN 3-bets, 2 folds, Hero calls

Flop: (7.4 SB) 8 6 7 (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets, Hero calls

Turn: (4.7 BB) A (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets, Hero raises, BTN calls

Final Pot: 8.7 BB

I think its ok, a bit concerned that the Ace just hits his range too hard and you will not have enough fold equity vs his range that chose to second barrel. I'm a little on the fence about whether we should give up on the river, as it seems like a lot of his hands might have a gutshot or open ender as well, and call turn intending to fold river.

i certainly think this is reasonable to do some of the time

agree w/dd that i might do it more often on a king or jack or whatever too

i dont like it
/
I dont think he b/f's anything in his range on this turn really except QJ exactly. You will fold QT/KT to a riv barrel

I think he prob checks back alot of Kx hands and maybe some pairs. If he bets TT-KK he never folds them

Maybe in dont bluff enough in this spot

Hard to say.

Could be good. Don´t do it too often though. I would probably continue with a river bet.

I agree with others, turnAce hits a nitty 3bettor to hard. But apart from that I think we could give arguments for Q9 being the perfect hand to go checkcall, checkraise with.

If u raise 30-35% from CO and this pretty nitty 3bettor reraises 15% on button he will have a much stronger handrange on most flops.So we will normally have a smaller valuecheckraise range on flop and therefore a smaller bluffrange. On a drawy board like this we just cant attack with every draw do we need to turn some draws into a checkcall. But which? We obviously want to checkcall draws with showdownvalue like AT, A9, A5.

But another consideration is which draw is the most obvious. On this flop it would be 9x I think. This would be the typical draw that many would checkraise on this flop. And I think villain will often call us down with Acehigh unless 9x improves. So couldnt we make a case for checkcalling the most obvious draw on flop with hands that got no showdownvalue against villains range? In this case this would be J9 and Q9. We now got the added benefit of not having to bet scary turns (like this Ace) and when we checkraise turn it will look less like a draw.

On a J 7 6 All things equal (and lets say we have to many draws in our range), wouldnt we prefer to checkraise 85 on flop and go for turncheckraise with 98 because villain will more often misplay his hand?

Waiting until the turn with the 'obv' one-card str8draw, like 9x here, may be an interesting concept on this rainbow board.

If the flop was two-toned, would we want to x/r the flop more or less?

just thinking out loud.

Waiting until the turn with the 'obv' one-card str8draw, like 9x here, may be an interesting concept on this rainbow board.

If the flop was two-toned, would we want to x/r the flop more or less?

just thinking out loud.

Yes very cool post kiddo. I think on the two-tone flop we would CR more but we would have to c/c some of our flush draws or we are certainly too draw-heavy.

Could be good. Don´t do it too often though. I would probably continue with a river bet.[/quote]

God I hope you stop posting. rly, STOP!

I meant to quote Kiddo's post and now I cant edit it

God I hope you stop posting. rly, STOP!

Your need to tell the world that u get angry at everything u find more stupid then urself (most things I guess). Its amusing. Well, IRL it would be a bit tiresome, like having a bright angry teenager around all the time. But at internet its funny. And u do make good strategyposts when u try.

LOL I think you misunderstood my post. But I was posting drunk out of boredom so what else is new?

Your first reply was awesome. It is basically stuff I have spent countless hours thinking about lately and you just went ahead and explained it to the world in such an easy manner. That was what I wanted you to stop doing, but I can hardly blame anyone for sharing nuggets

If we want to semibluff the turn, I wonder whether donking could be an option.
- opponent might fold his no pair/no draw hands just like to a xr. Donking might look more suspicious, but on the other hand the pot is smaller (giving more incentive to fold)
- if he decides to raise, things don't get more expensive for us than with a xr. If he calls, our bluff attempt was cheaper. And we avoid getting 3-bet. (Of course, we also have no chance of the turn going xx).

On a J 7 6 All things equal (and lets say we have to many draws in our range), wouldnt we prefer to checkraise 85 on flop and go for turncheckraise with 98 because villain will more often misplay his hand?

Nice post, can u explain this part a bit more for me? When you say villain will misplay his hand more if we c/r turn with 98 as opposed to flop, thanks.